Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Friday, February 26th, 2010, 00:03 AST

[00:03:16]

wagnerrp:

most tuner cards need firmware

[00:03:17]

bonelifer:

fun. have to remove the stock fan bracket so I can install the fan bracket for the addon cpu cooler bracket.

[00:04:50]

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[00:21:40]

dmb:

yup, its weird

[00:21:49]

dmb:

it has unexpected results if i don't go into windows

[00:21:53]

dmb:

such as audio not working

[00:21:57]

dmb:

sometimes no picture

[00:22:01]

dmb:

this is the cx18 driver

[00:23:30]

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[00:48:59]

slickrick:

hi. i want to get rid of all my video metadata and start over, letting jamu rebuild it as i was previously using the old metadata script. can I simply drop the video* tables?

[00:49:22]

slickrick:

actually not drop them, put purge all the data from them.

[00:49:50]

wagnerrp:

sure

[00:50:44]

slickrick:

cool ... i'i guess i shouldn't delete videosource tho. :)

[00:51:24]

wagnerrp:

metadata*, cast, genre, and country

[00:52:09]

slickrick:

great, thats what i was thinking. thanks wagnerrp.

[00:55:05]

slickrick:

what about videocategory?

[00:55:15]

wagnerrp:

that one too

[00:55:31]

wagnerrp:

technically, you can leave category, genre, country, and cast

[00:55:36]

wagnerrp:

theyre not harming anything

[00:56:02]

wagnerrp:

the videos get linked to them independently

[00:56:25]

wagnerrp:

if you ever go tinkering around in the database for any reason, you may also want to reset your numbering

[00:56:47]

slickrick:

sorry you lost me there, reset the numbering?

[00:57:26]

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[01:06:46]

wagnerrp:

the IDs

[01:07:11]

wagnerrp:

if you dont know what im talking

[01:07:18]

wagnerrp:

its obviously not something that bothers you

[01:08:10]

slickrick:

oh, like the numbering for the intid column?

[01:08:16]

wagnerrp:

right

[01:08:35]

wagnerrp:

alternatively, you could just unmount your media directory

[01:08:37]

wagnerrp:

and rescan

[01:08:46]

wagnerrp:

mythvideo will flush everything on its own

[01:09:08]

slickrick:

how would i reset the numbering otherwise?

[01:09:32]

slickrick:

i didn't notice any numbering wierdness since i haven't re-run jamu yet.

[01:09:46]

wagnerrp:

the only way to reset the numbering is to do so manually with a mysql call

[01:09:55]

wagnerrp:

its not a problem

[01:10:27]

wagnerrp:

i just found it annoying when my numbers were in the tens of thousands from repeated fresh scans

[01:10:43]

slickrick:

yeah i can see why.

[01:12:21]

slickrick:

question about jamu ... i find it doesn't work for me unless i specify the file locations in mythtvsetup. but, i don't want to use sg's.

[01:12:39]

slickrick:

for example i have fanrtdir: defined in my jamu.conf and it seems to ignore it completely.

[01:12:58]

wagnerrp:

then define them in the mythvideo setup in the frontend

[01:13:18]

wagnerrp:

why dont you want to use storage groups?

[01:13:31]

slickrick:

because then i can't use xine and mplayer ...

[01:13:46]

wagnerrp:

why do you want to use xine and mplayer?

[01:14:05]

slickrick:

gee i dunno ... force of habit? =)

[01:14:40]

wagnerrp:

dont expect external player support to ever get added to storage groups

[01:14:56]

slickrick:

really?

[01:15:02]

slickrick:

this doc says 0.23 http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythVideo

[01:15:30]

wagnerrp:

the only way to add support is to mount a filesystem for those players to use

[01:15:33]

slickrick:

it sort of indicated sg's were experimental in 0.22 as well which is what i am using.

[01:15:39]

wagnerrp:

or at least produce a file pipe for them to read from

[01:16:29]

slickrick:

i don't mind doing that. i don't see huge advantages for sg's in my setup ... massive backend, and multiple diskless frontends.

[01:16:50]

wagnerrp:

theres absolutely a huge advantage, you dont have to use NFS

[01:17:09]

wagnerrp:

and in 0.24, there is a planned 'file system watcher' which will take the place of manual scanning

[01:17:37]

[R]:

isn't that what inotify is for?

[01:17:48]

slickrick:

i know nfs is old and slow, but what is the disadvantage? i have had no problem with it playing all my media on my frontends.

[01:18:02]

wagnerrp:

slickrick: the user has to set it up

[01:18:20]

slickrick:

that a good point.

[01:18:41]

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[01:18:42]

wagnerrp:

the whole purpose of SGs is to simplify things for the user

[01:18:51]

slickrick:

tho in a lot of regular environments it's on person settings the whole thing up. ie. i set it all up... gf complains when it doesn't work.

[01:19:12]

slickrick:

maybe i need to give the internal player a go again.

[01:19:53]

achandra:

Not sure if anyone else has run into this...but...even after removing video storage groups I had a tough time playing iso's as described in the .22 guides for removal of storage groups. After moving the iso's to /media/videos and pointing frontend to this location now all is okay. Anyone else run into this?

[01:20:27]

wagnerrp:

achandra: ISOs are simply not yet supported, due to a limitation in the 3rd party dvd playback library

[01:20:33]

wagnerrp:

you have to use local access for that

[01:21:06]

slickrick:

wagnerrp: so isin't that a huge limitation to using sg's? if people are backing up their dvd collection as iso's and can no longer play them.

[01:21:34]

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[01:21:40]

wagnerrp:

which is why its currently listed as 'experimenta'

[01:21:47]

achandra:

wagnerrp, what i ran into is that though the /var/lib/mythtv/videos directory resides and even if you remove the storage group from backend...for some reason the FE doesnt like them to live there. Even if i enabled file browsing mode...it didnt work, until i re-defined a new location.

[01:21:49]

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[01:21:52]

foxbuntu:

anyone know much about the HVR-2250 and how well it works (or doesnt) in Myth?

[01:21:57]

achandra:

wagnerrp, took a bit to figure that out

[01:22:21]

wagnerrp:

foxbuntu: works fine for digital, not at all for analog

[01:22:29]

slickrick:

wagnerrp: point taken.

[01:22:30]

wagnerrp:

and thats limitations with the linux drivers... nothing to do with mythtv

[01:22:31]

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[01:22:48]

foxbuntu:

wagnerrp, does it support multirec on each QAM/ATSC encoder?

[01:22:57]

iamlindoro:

achandra, removing the backend is only half the equation

[01:23:01]

wagnerrp:

foxbuntu: yes

[01:23:07]

iamlindoro:

you left all the metadata that *pointed* at your now deleted SG

[01:23:28]

iamlindoro:

which is why it still didn't work. You need to remove the Video SG, set up a local path, and *rescan*

[01:23:48]

achandra:

iamlindoro, i see...and now that i created the /media/videos...the metadata was recreated upon downloading the new metadata?

[01:24:02]

iamlindoro:

No, the metadata was reset when you scanned

[01:24:03]

foxbuntu:

wagnerrp, one last ?, when setting it up, does it show up as seperate device nodes for each encoder?

[01:24:05]

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[01:24:16]

foxbuntu:

wagnerrp, I assume it does...but just curious

[01:24:17]

iamlindoro:

it removed the old references and found the files in their new location

[01:24:17]

wagnerrp:

foxbuntu: the encoders are not supported in linux

[01:24:19]

achandra:

iamlindoro, okay...makes sense as to why it *works* per se now

[01:24:22]

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[01:24:30]

wagnerrp:

digital tuners only

[01:24:42]

achandra:

iamlindoro, thanks for the pointer

[01:24:46]

iamlindoro:

np

[01:24:52]

wagnerrp:

and yes, they should show up as separate entries in /dev/dvb/

[01:25:14]

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[01:25:14]

foxbuntu:

wagnerrp, so it doesnt have a hardware encoder for the digital (sorry if this is a stupid ?, im just not 100% on tuners)

[01:25:16]

achandra:

iamlindoro, mythgame is another story megalithic messyness here ;)

[01:25:40]

wagnerrp:

foxbuntu: it does have two hardware encoders for analog, they are not currently supported under linux

[01:25:54]

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[01:26:21]

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[01:26:27]

foxbuntu:

wagnerrp, perfect. Thanks.

[01:26:48]

foxbuntu:

evening iamlindoro

[01:26:52]

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[01:27:08]

achandra:

iamlindoro, also with respect to the udev rules that are created..is that something custom done per mythtv developers..for example by default i have symlinks of /dev/dvd2 not /dev/dvd to /dev/sr0

[01:27:11]

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[01:27:32]

iamlindoro:

Myth does no creation of udev rules

[01:27:36]

wagnerrp:

udev rules are entirely up to your distro

[01:27:41]

iamlindoro:

^^

[01:27:42]

achandra:

k

[01:28:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Ah, a room full of MythTV users. I should come on IRC more often

[01:28:29]

achandra:

it would be channel name after all :/

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[01:31:01]

slickrick:

i can't get jamu to work without specifying dirs in mythtvsetup. i want to set them all in jamu.conf and not use sg's for now.

[01:31:15]

slickrick:

it always comlains about fanart but when i run ./jamu.py -f -C ./jamu.conf | grep fanartdir i see it's set.

[01:32:04]

wagnerrp:

you cant set them in jamu.conf

[01:32:36]

wagnerrp:

set them in mythfrontend, in the mythvideo setup

[01:32:52]

slickrick:

you kidding me .... my sample jamu.conf example that came with my distro shows a setting for them.

[01:32:52]

wagnerrp:

local folders get set in the frontend, sgs get set in mythtv-setup

[01:33:03]

wagnerrp:

and jamu simply reads either from the database

[01:34:00]

slickrick:

okay, but what if jamu is not running on a frontend? like if it's running on a backend with no fe?

[01:34:13]

wagnerrp:

then set up mythvideo on that backend

[01:35:04]

slickrick:

i don't want to do that ... besides my backend has no X.

[01:35:26]

wagnerrp:

so forward the display to another machine that does have a X server

[01:36:03]

slickrick:

i should have thought of that ... it's what i do with mythtvsetup. thanks.

[01:37:16]

wagnerrp:

the folders you define in the config file are to allow jamu to be used independently of mythtv and its database

[01:37:19]

achandra:

Also..with respect to the fast forwarding of videos...notice that anything faster than 3x ff causes a crash of the video. any ideas?

[01:37:47]

wagnerrp:

achandra: anything faster than 3x causes mythtv to start jumping by keyframe

[01:38:05]

wagnerrp:

the internal player is designed to use exact seeking with a prebuilt keyframe list

[01:38:29]

wagnerrp:

and has problems with playback of some content if it doesnt have that

[01:40:27]

wagnerrp:

you can try building a seektable for that specific file with mythcommflag

[01:42:20]

slickrick:

as always thanks for your help wagnerrp. installing mythvideo on the BE works great.

[01:43:28]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: i assume at this point, the ISO stuff isnt going to make it in for 0.23?

[01:43:48]

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[01:43:52]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Shame, I was looking forward to that.

[01:43:52]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, You'd have to ask GreyFoxx, as that's his project

[01:44:07]

wagnerrp:

fair enough

[01:44:27]

iamlindoro:

but yeah, since we're in freeze it's a definite no

[01:44:31]

jamesd2:

wagnerrp, do you have a url that explains how to do that?

[01:44:42]

wagnerrp:

jamesd2: to do....?

[01:45:08]

jamesd2:

wagnerrp, you can try building a seektable for that specific file with mythcommflag

[01:45:44]

wagnerrp:

http://mythtv.org/wiki/Mythcommflag#Non_Flagging_Operations

[01:46:01]

wagnerrp:

use the '--video' and '--rebuild' options

[01:46:10]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Out of curiosity, is there a master list of the new features for 0.23?

[01:46:43]

wagnerrp:

http://mythtv.org/wiki/Release_Notes_-_0.23

[01:46:44]

jamesd2:

wagnerrp, can it flag commercials and do the --video --rebuilt options all in one pass?

[01:46:47]

wagnerrp:

although its rather vacent

[01:47:08]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

That's why I asked. I'd seen that page.

[01:47:41]

wagnerrp:

jamesd2: not sure why you'd want to

[01:48:31]

jamesd2:

wagnerrp, so that the show supports fast forward at more than 3x and still have commercial flagged. but after reading i see that i can't do it...

[01:48:57]

wagnerrp:

recordings will already have a seektable built when you record them

[01:49:06]

wagnerrp:

and mythtranscode will rebuild it after a transcode

[01:49:23]

wagnerrp:

unless something is broken, there should be no need to build a seektable against a recording

[01:49:35]

wagnerrp:

and there should be no need to build a commflag against a non-recording

[01:50:38]

achandra:

wagnerrp, i find that the function for 3x, 5x etc works okay for recorded tv. Just barfs when trying to do it on transcoded dvd's.

[01:50:56]

wagnerrp:

achandra: very possible, for the above reason

[01:51:02]

achandra:

k

[01:51:03]

jamesd2:

isee the same thing as achandra does... and really fast forward basicly only mutes the audio and moves the file at little more than real time i found it was haster to choose shorten play back time option to 1.5 times normal

[01:51:31]

wagnerrp:

jamesd2: fast forward will run at 3x, or whatever the fastest your CPU is capable of decoding at

[01:51:36]

jamesd2:

i see it on recorded tv, don't use dvd's in my fast forward

[01:51:40]

wagnerrp:

3x and below do a full decode

[01:51:47]

achandra:

wagnerrp, however...im just happy even in experimental mode, my iso's appear to work just fine now.

[01:52:01]

wagnerrp:

5x and above just jump between keyframes

[01:52:31]

jamesd2:

i have a 2.4ghz dual core opteron, 4GB ram, and 256GB sata 7200 rpm disks and nvidia fx1400 ... it should handle faster than realtime

[01:52:40]

wagnerrp:

what content?

[01:53:05]

jamesd2:

recorded tv off a kworld 115 digital so HD

[01:53:06]

wagnerrp:

a 256GB disk drive?

[01:53:16]

jamesd2:

well a pair of them

[01:53:25]

wagnerrp:

there is no such thing

[01:53:35]

jamesd2:

okay its actually 250GB

[01:53:49]

jamesd2:

sorry fingers are used to typing ram amount s

[01:53:59]

wagnerrp:

anyway, yes... it should be able to handle 2–3x realtime of full bitrate ATSC

[01:54:10]

wagnerrp:

probably closer to 2

[01:57:08]

jamesd2:

if the economy didn't suck right now i would of probably upgraded the video card and got larger harddrives by now... the cpus are basicly maxed out at 2.4ghz dual core with 1MB l2 per core on a 939 motherboard.

[01:57:30]

wagnerrp:

yeah... not much you can do with an old 939 board

[01:57:33]

jamesd2:

getting faster doesn't make financial sense

[01:57:54]

wagnerrp:

if you can even find a faster chip for purchase

[01:59:02]

jamesd2:

there are 2.8ghz dual core i beleve, but its like $300+ and then am2 cpu and mother board is less, but the system has 4GB of ecc ram ( eh it was a gift from Sun.com) couldn't turn it down.

[01:59:55]

wagnerrp:

also consider that was a new system 5 years ago

[02:00:29]

jamesd2:

yeah i had it about 4 years now... Sun ultra 20 large config with extra harddrive...

[02:02:15]

slickrick:

i can't believe there is no setting in jamu to make it assume or try the filename as inetref.

[02:02:47]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I wonder exactly how little processing power you can get away with on a MythTV system. Anyone had any luck running the whole thing on an Atom, assuming playback offloading to the GPU?

[02:03:09]

[R]:

well you're not going to get good comm flagging

[02:03:23]

[R]:

but a dual core atom will work... assuming no analog encoding has to be done

[02:03:42]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Well, analog is dead, figuratively speaking, anyway.

[02:04:11]

bonelifer:

YES. New non-oem Cooler installed on the CPU.

[02:04:20]

bonelifer:

that mama-jama is huge for something that's smaller than other non-stock coolers.

[02:04:58]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

What did you get?

[02:05:23]

bonelifer:

Cooler Master GeminII S

[02:06:18]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I pulled a picture. Interesting design.

[02:06:19]

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[02:06:55]

bonelifer:

it's close too are just a little over a quarter the size of the entire micro atx board

[02:07:17]

bonelifer:

this is with the single fan option

[02:07:21]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

It would be close quarters in a MicroATX.

[02:07:42]

bonelifer:

well it's the Antec Fusion Remote Black, so height isn't a problem

[02:07:57]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I got something similar recently, but I opted for a vertical fan

[02:08:37]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I had the height, but the area around it wasn't large.

[02:09:16]

bonelifer:

I was worried at first earlier. Having to remove the oem mounting plate. But then I thought, hey you're using a non-stock cooler, stop the madness of being worried., You've already voided the warranty on the CPU as the instructions said using non-oem heatsinks void the warranty

[02:09:46]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

It does? I've never noticed that.

[02:09:53]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

maybe I should actually read the manual.

[02:09:53]

bonelifer:

yep

[02:09:58]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Intel or AMD?

[02:10:00]

bonelifer:

AMD

[02:10:14]

bonelifer:

Phenom II X2 550 Black Edition 3.1

[02:10:42]

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[02:11:01]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm still on my old X2 5600+

[02:11:24]

bonelifer:

it was cheap enough

[02:11:53]

bonelifer:

well $99.00

[02:11:56]

bonelifer:

USD

[02:12:17]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

not too old. But going to Phenom would mean I'd have to go from AM2 to AM3, and that means a new motherboard, and some motherboards are using ddr3, and before you know it...

[02:12:22]

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[02:12:49]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

One of these days, I suppose.

[02:13:14]

bonelifer:

RAM was 109 (89.00 after rebate from OCZ)

[02:13:27]

bonelifer:

for 2 X 2GB==4GB

[02:13:33]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Do you run a combined FE/BE or separate?

[02:13:47]

bonelifer:

combined or I would of went for lower specs

[02:13:53]

achandra:

i think this is a little of stretch..but any plans of building in the aggregators similar to boxee in myth? aka..cbs feeds etc?

[02:14:13]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Achandra, there is Mythnetvision, I suppose

[02:14:14]

bonelifer:

I may do some background stuff which makes the extra umph at least worthwhile

[02:14:20]

wagnerrp:

achandra: http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythNetvision

[02:14:25]

achandra:

k cool

[02:15:02]

achandra:

i hate killing the FE on myth to jump to boxee and back...a pain in the arse..so if this works..that'd be awesome!

[02:15:17]

achandra:

like pandaro support...for example in media...what a god send that'd be

[02:15:21]

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[02:15:21]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I have my backend merged with my file server. The old parts go into the frontend systems.

[02:15:25]

wagnerrp:

achandra: why not add a menu entry for boxee?

[02:15:40]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

So I need very little power in the front and a bunch in the back for transcoding.

[02:15:43]

achandra:

wagnerrp: really? is that possible?

[02:15:50]

wagnerrp:

just edit the menu xml

[02:15:52]

bonelifer:

Seriously this is the mentally exausting. I haven't put a system together since around the first P4, sometime around then.

[02:15:56]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Achandra, of course.

[02:16:06]

bonelifer:

so worried I'd fry something.

[02:16:08]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I put in Hulu Desktop for Linux as well.

[02:16:10]

achandra:

wagnerrp, i see cool.

[02:16:15]

wagnerrp:

when you call an external command, mythtv stops responding to lirc commands until it exits

[02:16:40]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Bonelifer, it is always a risk. No warranties on home built systems.

[02:17:07]

bonelifer:

was just worried I'd get sloppy since I'm out of practice.

[02:17:26]

bonelifer:

I mean we're talk around $1100–1380

[02:17:41]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Exactly.

[02:17:56]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The only part that truly worries me is the CPU/CPU fan installation.

[02:18:06]

wagnerrp:

expensive system, unless youre counting a bunch of hard drives in with that caost

[02:18:09]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The pins on CPUs are very delicate.

[02:18:46]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I just replaced a CPU fan on my main system, and it went smoothly, but the time before, the heat paste had fused the fan to the CPU to the point the two wouldn't separate.

[02:19:10]

wagnerrp:

GadgetWisdomGuru: thats why you dont use thermal paste

[02:19:11]

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[02:19:26]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I thought you were supposed to use thermal paste?

[02:19:54]

wagnerrp:

thermal paste is supposed to be used for attaching ramsinks, or possibly chipset sinks without retension clips

[02:20:05]

wagnerrp:

if you have any form of retention clip, you just use grease

[02:20:31]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Excuse me then

[02:20:34]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Thermal grase.

[02:20:36]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

grease.

[02:20:45]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I misspoke

[02:20:48]

bonelifer:

http://www.williamjacoby.net/files/that.html

[02:21:01]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The stuff still has this tendency to fuse.

[02:21:08]

wagnerrp:

cheap stuff does, sure

[02:21:11]

bonelifer:

that accounts for some of the build. Some other misc stuff I could of done without, but you know

[02:21:22]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I checked the bottle. It's grease.

[02:21:38]

wagnerrp:

i accidently yanked a P4 out of the socket of one of the systems at work

[02:21:58]

wagnerrp:

because it was attached to the heatsink harder than the socket

[02:22:09]

wagnerrp:

but once it was out, a simple twist and it detached

[02:22:10]

bonelifer:

remember the episode of Screensavers were Yoshi used a P4 to do some cooking.

[02:22:27]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Wagnerrp, that is exactly what happened the second to last time. And the CPU never worked again.

[02:22:56]

wagnerrp:

this one continued working just fine, once i dropped in a heatsink with a working fan

[02:23:09]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

That's why I am always worried when I remove a CPU fan. I'm very careful, but one wrong move could cause an expensive loss.

[02:23:39]

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[02:23:40]

wagnerrp:

like i said, that only happens with the cheap silicon stuff

[02:23:59]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I have a bottle of Zalman Thermal Grease.

[02:24:04]

wagnerrp:

the white crap they give you for free with some aftermarket heatsinks

[02:24:12]

bonelifer:

there's just nothing good tech wise on cable, now that G4 murdered TechTV.

[02:24:15]

wagnerrp:

really... i would think zalman would sell decent stuff

[02:24:45]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

They did. I think maybe you have to not replace a fan while the system is still hot.

[02:25:03]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The last time, I let it cool down for a bit. It made it easier.

[02:25:19]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But that is just a theory on my part.

[02:26:11]

wagnerrp:

heat has got nothing to do with it, so much as age and composition

[02:26:37]

wagnerrp:

its at the point where all the grease has cooked off

[02:27:33]

wagnerrp:

anyway, thats only even a problem with the AMD desktop chips

[02:27:52]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Well, I've been using almost exclusively AMD for about five years now.

[02:27:53]

wagnerrp:

all intel stuff, and the amd server stuff, have a separate retention clip for the processor itself

[02:28:12]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Next build, I've decided to reconsider that and possibly go Intel.

[02:28:24]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But that is likely a few months to a year away.

[02:28:31]

wagnerrp:

theres no way you can remove the processor without tearing the whole socket off the board

[02:28:44]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Sounds good

[02:28:57]

wagnerrp:

the processors also dont have pins to get damaged

[02:29:03]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I need a good processor to transcode for archival purposes.

[02:30:55]

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[02:34:05]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Although I wish I had a lossless transcode method for the HD-PVR

[02:34:17]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But I make do.

[02:42:14]

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[03:23:38]

oobe:

GadgetWisdomGuru, what type of video does the HD-PVR make?

[03:24:05]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

H.264

[03:24:29]

oobe:

i guess thats why

[03:24:37]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Why what?

[03:24:43]

oobe:

i dont know much about it i was just curious

[03:24:46]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Okay.

[03:25:04]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

MythTV supports MPEG2 Lossless right now.

[03:25:11]

oobe:

i would of thought you could do lossless transcoding with any media type

[03:25:27]

oobe:

yea thats what streams our broadcasters use mpeg2

[03:25:32]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Alas, no.

[03:25:41]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

My broadcast feeds use MPEG2 also.

[03:25:59]

oobe:

oh and the HD-PVR transcodes it

[03:26:03]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

No

[03:26:29]

oobe:

then how does it end up being h.264

[03:26:32]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

The HD-PVR is an analog-digital converter

[03:26:39]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

It exploits the analog loophole.

[03:26:53]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

namely that certain companies encrypt everything.

[03:27:59]

oobe:

so it captures analogue content to h.264

[03:28:21]

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[03:28:22]

oobe:

have you heard of nuvexport

[03:28:33]

oobe:

its handy for exporting stuff for archiving

[03:33:05]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Yes

[03:33:09]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I use it

[03:33:37]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

It is buggy at times. But mostly because ffmpeg, mencoder, and transcode, all of which it depends on, keep changing.

[03:34:59]

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[03:35:01]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

That's why I'm hoping someone who knows more than I do might tackle the lossless issue. Because if I can cut the commercials, any number of programs can transcode it.

[03:35:38]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

But, until someone does it, I'll make do with what I have and what I can put together.

[03:35:58]

oobe:

you can make the cut points in myth and tell nuvexport to use them

[03:36:08]

bonelifer:

MKV + H 264 + AAC?

[03:36:41]

oobe:

Enable Myth cutlist? [No]

[03:36:55]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Oobe, I understand nuvexport. Not the issue

[03:37:06]

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[03:37:07]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Bonelifer, beg pardon?

[03:37:22]

oobe:

yea i dont really get it just started asking about it out of curiosity

[03:38:04]

bonelifer:

MKV=matroshka(file container), h.264 =video codec. and AAC is a sound codec often used.

[03:38:19]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Bonelifer, what about it, I mean.

[03:38:55]

bonelifer:

who knows!

[03:39:09]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

I'm confused.

[03:40:00]

bonelifer:

I'm so new to video stuff, I'm always confused, don't listen to me about video archving. :)

[03:42:07]

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[03:43:25]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

Bonelifer, the problem isn't what format to turn it into, but how to get it there.

[03:43:43]

GadgetWisdomGuru:

On that note, it is late here. I'm going to head out.

[03:43:46]

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[03:52:30]

achandra:

trying to get the mythnettv from mythplugins_0.23_trunk working on mythbuntu 9.10...can someone assist?

[03:52:48]

achandra:

i believe i have the proper dependencies but the ./configure doesnt build properly

[03:52:51]

wagnerrp:

there is no mythnettv in mythplugins

[03:55:10]

achandra:

wagnerrp, oh..thought it resided in mythplugins_0.23.0~trunk23567.orig.tar.gz

[03:55:24]

wagnerrp:

mythnettv has never been an official plugin

[03:55:31]

wagnerrp:

and trunk has not yet been branched to 0.23

[03:56:17]

achandra:

i see..any way to build into the current version of mythbuntu i have? aka mythbuntu 9.10?

[03:59:22]

oobe:

achandra, if you are using .22 then no

[03:59:43]

achandra:

oobe, indeed i am

[03:59:52]

oobe:

if you are using the trunk repos then it should install with the rest of the plugins

[04:00:14]

achandra:

i see

[04:00:31]

oobe:

but as wagnerrp .23 does not exist yet and trunk will go through various stages on instability before it is branched to .23

[04:00:48]

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[04:00:52]

achandra:

and im curious if i wanted to use the trunk repos instead of the build I have now..what is required?

[04:00:53]

wagnerrp:

no, there is no mythnetvision in trunk either

[04:01:00]

wagnerrp:

it will not be installed in 'mythplugins'

[04:01:07]

wagnerrp:

erm... there is a mythnetvision

[04:01:09]

wagnerrp:

there is no mythnettv

[04:01:32]

achandra:

sorry my mistake

[04:01:44]

achandra:

mythnetvision it is

[04:02:25]

achandra:

and mythnetvision is in the trunk and not part of 0.22 or cant be built back into 0.22?

[04:02:44]

oobe:

achandra, no it cant

[04:02:51]

oobe:

like i said earlier

[04:03:03]

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[04:04:21]

achandra:

oobe, I'm wondering..is it then possible i have a mythbuntu box 9.10, and would like to build from trunk. Any pointers on how to do that?

[04:06:14]

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[04:06:19]

oobe:

achandra, there is no need but yea its possible

[04:06:26]

oobe:

and not to hard if you install the deps

[04:06:49]

oobe:

i think you need to understand that moving to trunk means you cant go back to .22

[04:07:16]

achandra:

k

[04:07:52]

oobe:

if you want to use trunk they have a repo on the mythbuntu site so building is not necessary

[04:07:56]

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[04:09:14]

oobe:

if you intend to change to trunk despite being warned against it then you better make sure you have recent database backups of mythconverg from your .22 install

[04:09:45]

oobe:

then it is possible to restore you backup and remove the trunk repos and reinstall the .22 ones

[04:10:56]

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[04:14:32]

dmb:

i get weird load errors when using the guide

[04:14:41]

dmb:

and it takes a long time to scroll

[04:14:54]

dmb:

for every scroll, i get errors in the console saying it couldn't write file

[04:15:09]

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[04:15:15]

dmb:

2010-02–26 02:10:19.786 Failed to save to /home/dmb/.mythtv/channels/abc.jpg

[04:15:16]

dmb:

etc

[04:22:10]

achandra:

oobe,wagnerrp thanks for the assistance

[04:22:23]

achandra:

time for some z's

[04:25:47]

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[04:52:36]

oobe:

dmb, have you setup channel icons and is /home/dmb/.mythtv/channels writeable?

[04:53:37]

dmb:

yes to both

[04:53:57]

dmb:

oobe: if you mean by setting up channel icons, I hit download icons in mythtv-setup

[04:54:30]

oobe:

maybe post some more logs in pastebin

[04:55:35]

dmb:

oobe: sorry, i'll post tomorrow, falling asleep now

[04:58:42]

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[05:16:10]

yalu_:

I have a very important question to ask: would an old emac G3 be fast enough to use used as a basic MythTV frontend?

[05:23:30]

clever:

yalu_: ive used a 400mhz P2 as a frontend before

[05:23:45]

clever:

it could just bearly handle playback, but it was usable if i did nothing else

[05:24:11]

clever:

anything bettwe and it can only improve

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[07:26:35]

Zdeno:

hello does anyone using myth with iptv ?

[07:27:40]

oobe:

my router doesnt support it but there is a guide for using iptv and myth out there

[07:28:36]

oobe:

http://avenard.com/iptv/MythTV.html

[07:28:49]

oobe:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/IPTV

[07:30:36]

Zdeno:

i upgraded mythtv to version 0.22_p23586 and got problem with stability coz every time when mythtv cant get any packet then application freeze... i must unplug usb keyboard then plug in it again... but mythfrontend crashed.. there is no screen... maybe blue sometimes.. but i can see in ps ax the mythfrontend still running ^^

[07:31:11]

oobe:

are you talking about using iptv still?

[07:33:52]

Zdeno:

aye for iptv you need to have playlist with ip addresses everything works fine on previous old version 0.22_p23069.. when frontend could not load address there was pop-up alert message.. application freeze for a while but without crash

[07:35:35]

oobe:

have you checked the logs

[07:37:30]

Zdeno:

where i can find frontend logs?

[07:38:07]

Zdeno:

coz in /var/log/mythtv are backend logs only

[07:39:37]

oobe:

Zdeno, that means you not logging mythfrontend

[07:40:07]

oobe:

start mythfrontend with mythfrontend -l /var/log/mythtv/mythfrontend.log

[07:41:39]

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[08:00:07]

Zdeno:

will do when ill be back at home thank you. Ill log back when ill know what frontend logs say

[08:07:05]

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[08:18:35]

yalu_:

clever: ok thank you, that's useful info. now I must only figure out how a G3 of 233 MHz stands up against a P2 (it's a risc after all)

[08:29:16]

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[10:17:28]

tmkt:

Morning

[10:27:00]

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[10:27:13]

oobe:

morn

[10:27:40]

oobe:

yalu, why is it a risk ?

[10:34:28]

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[10:48:39]

XLV:

oobe, risc, not risk

[10:49:07]

XLV:

as opposed to cisc

[10:49:49]

XLV:

and even if its faster than a p2 clock for clock, its unbearably slow by today standards, even for a myth fe

[11:02:07]

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[11:04:42]

clever:

XLV: i think that might be because it lacks floating point, which ffmpeg needs heavily

[11:09:28]

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[11:10:56]

oobe:

XLV, i was not familiar with that term

[11:11:49]

oobe:

you would definatly need to use a legacy theme and only watch sd content

[11:15:29]

Beirdo:

XLV: which processor?

[11:16:25]

XLV:

oobe, i doubt a g3/233 or a p2 at similar freqs have the cpu power to decode xvid/divx

[11:16:39]

XLV:

iirc they needed hardware assist to decode even mpeg2

[11:16:48]

XLV:

remember those creative mpeg decoder cards?

[11:18:25]

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[11:19:21]

XLV:

Creative Labs DXr3 MPEG2 decoder card

[11:19:26]

XLV:

http://www.ciao.co.uk/Creative_Technology_MPE . . . ard__5617982

[11:19:56]

oobe:

yea i think your right

[11:21:32]

GreyFoxx:

I have 3 or 4 dxr3's :) IEven have them in use for a while for myth playback a long time ago

[11:21:40]

GreyFoxx:

the tv out was great on them

[11:21:44]

XLV:

heh.. i remember back in 95 i payed like 800 euro to get the diamond stealth vram... with the extra 2MB vram module and MPEG1 accelerator

[11:22:12]

XLV:

btw that card is still in use

[11:22:15]

XLV:

in a server

[11:22:27]

GreyFoxx:

http://phaze.org/mythtv_dxr3setup.jpg

[11:22:32]

GreyFoxx:

long time ago :)

[11:23:19]

GreyFoxx:

I even went as far as writing an X server that worked over it but lost it in a hd failure and had no good backups of it :/

[11:25:12]

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[11:27:00]

Beirdo:

Heya, GreyFoxx

[11:27:10]

Beirdo:

that'll teach ya not to use remove SCM :)

[11:27:11]

Beirdo:

hehe

[11:27:15]

Beirdo:

remote rather

[11:27:49]

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[11:31:30]

Beirdo:

we all have to learn the hard way sometimes :)

[11:49:31]

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[11:49:37]

oobe:

GreyFoxx, can yuo still use those decoder cards with myth?

[11:50:51]

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[11:51:25]

oobe:

im guessing not actually

[11:51:30]

oobe:

interesting though

[11:53:33]

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[12:04:36]

GreyFoxx:

oobe: No and I never got it to the point of putting it into myth proper. It only existed on my stuff :)

[12:04:57]

GreyFoxx:

but for a year several of my old P166's were my diskless frontends with it :)

[12:05:10]

oobe:

nice

[12:05:28]

oobe:

oh so that was your own personal code that you never released

[12:06:12]

oobe:

im thinking about trying to use my mce usb remote with a usb to rs232 adapter

[12:06:41]

oobe:

simple cause the mobo the remote uses supports s3 for suspend to ram wakeup via usb

[12:06:50]

oobe:

but it supports s5 on com1

[12:07:03]

oobe:

was thinking i could fully shut it down rather than suspend

[12:07:22]

oobe:

do you think that could work

[12:08:23]

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[12:30:08]

swerve:

anyone know where the font size settings are for channel numbers in mythweb?

[12:30:23]

swerve:

they used to be big, now are really small – but are big in "lite" template

[12:30:35]

swerve:

I searched through the files though and couldn't find the setting

[12:32:14]

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[12:33:50]

Brad-D:

beirdo: by any chance do you have your nfs server on today?

[12:34:39]

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Beirdo:

nope

[12:40:34]

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[12:43:31]

Brad-D:

k :)

[12:44:52]

Beirdo:

gimme a sec

[12:46:10]

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[12:46:32]

Brad-D:

don't worry about it, if it isn't on. I just thought if it was, I would love to get your nfs config

[12:47:18]

Beirdo:

see:

[12:47:32]

Beirdo:

http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/1/2006-09-12

[12:47:48]

Beirdo:

scroll down to 15:45

[12:48:25]

XLV:

oobe, even if you set it in bios to do suspend to hdd?

[12:49:01]

oobe:

s3 is only supported in the bios for usb wake up

[12:49:25]

Brad-D:

perfect, thanks

[12:49:49]

Beirdo:

no problem :)

[12:50:06]

oobe:

but it appears as if i could shut it down fully and wake up using com1 according to /proc/acpi/wakeup

[12:50:11]

XLV:

oobe, on some mbs you need to flip a jumper of usb wake up

[12:50:28]

XLV:

or was it usb power on?

[12:50:34]

oobe:

according to my manual it only supports usb s3

[12:51:03]

oobe:

i would like to fully shut it down and turn it on using remote though

[12:51:18]

oobe:

but the resume time of suspend to ram is much faster than a full boot

[12:51:22]

oobe:

so thats a plus

[12:51:58]

oobe:

i dont like the idea of it using electricity and possibly over using components while in s3

[12:52:16]

XLV:

yeah, exactly, and suspend to hdd the system doesnt lose state on a power outage

[12:52:39]

XLV:

suspend to hdd doesnt use any more current than when the system is on standby

[12:54:44]

devinheitmueller:

Be forewarned: the quality of driver support in terms of the ability for the USB device to wake the system up varies greatly by driver/device.

[12:54:54]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro or xris.... got some deletions to do on the wiki

[12:55:04]

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[12:55:07]

oobe:

yeah unfortunatly usb doesnt support s4 wake

[12:55:18]

wagnerrp:

what exactly is S4?

[12:55:24]

oobe:

and when i tried suspend to disk it just powered down

[12:55:26]

clever:

ive found that even a plain PS2 keyboard cant handle suspend

[12:55:28]

Beirdo:

it's an Audi

[12:55:36]

clever:

windows b*tches that the keyboard wont even let it enter standby

[12:55:37]

oobe:

s4 is suspend to disk / hibernate

[12:55:44]

wagnerrp:

i thought that was S5

[12:55:45]

clever:

useless windows drivers :P

[12:55:46]

XLV:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspend_to_RAM#Power_States

[12:55:52]

XLV:

s5 is off

[12:55:53]

devinheitmueller:

You need more than just the host controller to support wakeup, you need the driver support to work as well for the USB device in question.

[12:55:59]

iamlindoro:

done

[12:56:26]

oobe:

wagnerrp, s5 is actually fully powered down i think

[12:56:34]

devinheitmueller:

iamlindoro: if only you could set them on fire for real...

[12:56:40]

iamlindoro:

alas!

[12:57:25]

oobe:

wagnerrp, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Configu . . . Power_States

[12:57:27]

** wagnerrp proposes a feature request for mythburn **

[12:57:32]

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[12:58:06]

wagnerrp:

to be honest, i never saw the point to hibernate

[12:58:16]

Beirdo:

I do.

[12:58:25]

Beirdo:

I use it every time I take my laptop somewhere

[12:58:26]

wagnerrp:

no so far as with mythtv

[12:58:30]

Beirdo:

Oooh :)

[12:58:32]

wagnerrp:

i used to use it with my laptop to keep work open

[12:58:39]

Beirdo:

yeah, true

[12:58:39]

clever:

wagnerrp: it lets me psysicaly disassemble the desktop, then put it back together a month later and the OS be none the wiser!

[12:58:47]

wagnerrp:

but with mythtv, who cares

[12:58:56]

Beirdo:

yeah, just shut it down

[12:58:57]

wagnerrp:

its going to start back up in the state you want it anyway

[12:59:04]

clever:

yeah, with myth you can generaly just standby (to ram)

[12:59:04]

oobe:

so anyway in /proc/acpi/wakeup it appears that com1 is s5 so i am thinking about getting a rs232 remote reciever in the hope that i could fully power down or suspend to disk and wake it using the power button on my remote

[12:59:09]

wagnerrp:

and will probably just end up taking longer with standby

[12:59:12]

clever:

if you loose power and shut it off wrong, nothing is damaged

[12:59:12]

devinheitmueller:

It was more of an issue when system boot used to take longer than it does today.

[12:59:16]

wagnerrp:

it certainly will when shutdown

[12:59:27]

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[13:00:29]

wagnerrp:

devinheitmueller: except now you have the opposite, weve gone from 256MB of memory on a 40MB/s disk, to 2–4GB of memory on a 100MB/s disk

[13:00:31]

oobe:

i like it the way it is i just dont know how much elictricity suspend to ram actually wastes

[13:00:52]

wagnerrp:

oobe: it wastes something under 5W

[13:01:05]

oobe:

per hr day week?

[13:01:09]

wagnerrp:

and depending on the hardware, usually far under 5W

[13:01:10]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: speak for yourself. I started at 64K and a 0MB disk.

[13:01:40]

clever:

devinheitmueller: in those days, bootup was seconds

[13:01:46]

wagnerrp:

devinheitmueller: i didnt start much beyond that, but i didnt start hibernating until my P3 laptop

[13:01:49]

clever:

maybe better then even a modern pc

[13:01:55]

devinheitmueller:

clever: in those days, bootup was instantaneous.

[13:02:06]

devinheitmueller:

clever: flip switch, see prompt.

[13:02:13]

clever:

devinheitmueller: not really instant, but faster then your monitor could warm up

[13:02:29]

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[13:02:46]

devinheitmueller:

clever: depends if you had one of those "floppy drive things". My TRS-80 had a bootup time that was in milliseconds.

[13:03:37]

clever:

even wiht a floppy drive, it didnt usualy access them until you enter the command

[13:03:48]

wagnerrp:

oobe: anyway, a computer on standby for a year is only going to consume a few dollars worth of electricity

[13:03:50]

clever:

no POST really

[13:04:02]

XLV:

it was roms.. and 16KB or so

[13:04:13]

oobe:

thanks wagnerrp i think i will leave it how it is then

[13:04:14]

devinheitmueller:

clever: depends on the hardware. The Apple for example pretty much *always* did a POST.

[13:04:17]

wagnerrp:

IMHO, its worth that much for shutdown/startup times of a couple seconds

[13:04:21]

oobe:

it actually works awesome

[13:04:24]

clever:

devinheitmueller: i'm refering to a C64

[13:04:34]

XLV:

now even if we had an OS in nand, it would take some secs to read from it, OSs now are huge

[13:04:38]

devinheitmueller:

clever: For the C64, that is definitely true.

[13:04:54]

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[13:05:07]

clever:

XLV: yeah, ive got gentoo on a stick here, ~30 seconds to bootup (grub->rc.local)

[13:05:27]

clever:

but ive got an alternate method that reads ~300mb of files into ram, and then it can run without the stick

[13:05:28]

XLV:

btw spectrum 128K here.. then amiga 500

[13:05:38]

XLV:

still got the speccy, though it doesnt work

[13:05:41]

devinheitmueller:

clever: which is one of the big plusses for my Apple IIe – you didn't have to know the magic sequence "LOAD *,8,1". You just whacked the power switch and it booted the floppy.

[13:06:05]

Beirdo:

devinheitmueller: very loudly and flatulently :)

[13:06:15]

clever:

devinheitmueller: sounds like how the game carts on the c64 worked

[13:06:26]

clever:

the rom in the cart basicaly replaced the OS roms

[13:06:26]

wagnerrp:

devinheitmueller: sure, but your Apple IIe didnt come with a TURBO BUTTON!

[13:06:39]

Beirdo:

I grew up with Apple ][+

[13:06:47]

clever:

i think my 100mhz pc had a turbo!

[13:06:54]

Beirdo:

and then C64

[13:07:06]

Beirdo:

then an PC AT clone :)

[13:07:12]

Beirdo:

then it all went downhill

[13:07:14]

Beirdo:

hehe

[13:07:43]

devinheitmueller:

clever: Even the 8MHz 80286 had a turbo. Forget 100MHz.

[13:07:46]

Beirdo:

had a few Commodore Fat 40s in there too

[13:08:09]

wagnerrp:

even my old 8MHz 8086 had a turbo

[13:08:28]

clever:

devinheitmueller: that case was weird, you basicaly had a blob of 40 jumpers to select what speed it would display on the front panel in both modes

[13:08:35]

wagnerrp:

my the time you got to 100MHz, i thought they had dropped the turbos, because you couldnt see the speed on the 2-digit LED readout anyway

[13:08:45]

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[13:08:48]

clever:

you where basicaly jumpering each of the 7 segments (on both displays) to either normal, turbo, or both

[13:09:26]

devinheitmueller:

clever: Yeah, I had a few PCs like that too.

[13:09:31]

Beirdo:

make it say oO for slow

[13:09:42]

Beirdo:

and OO for fast?

[13:09:48]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: Yeah, the 8MHz 8086 had it too.

[13:10:41]

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[13:12:14]

Beirdo:

yo quiero cerveza

[13:13:16]

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[13:20:02]

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[13:20:42]

skd5aner:

if mythtranscode deletes an original recording, is there *any* way to get it back?

[13:20:58]

skd5aner:

I thought I had the setting to keep the original, but apparently, I didn't :(

[13:23:31]

Beirdo:

ummm, Linux doesn't usually come with an undelete for files

[13:23:54]

Beirdo:

there MAY be some tools for some filesystems if you get there immediately after

[13:24:09]

Beirdo:

but God help you if even a single inode gets reused

[13:25:04]

skd5aner:

it wasn't real important, I can live without

[13:25:22]

Beirdo:

probably a good thing :)

[13:25:34]

jams:

probably best to record the program again

[13:27:49]

skd5aner:

It was an episode of SNL from 2008 :(

[13:27:56]

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[13:27:59]

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[13:29:26]

skd5aner:

had a couple of funny sketches I wanted to cut out, and typically use nuvexport, but had to do a lossless because there was a "blip" in the recording and ffmpeg would flake out with teh audio/video sync on that segment

[13:32:40]

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[13:41:23]

** dustybin fiddles with his backend **

[13:42:06]

Beirdo:

heheh

[13:42:10]

Beirdo:

that just sounds wrong

[13:42:56]

jams:

yes it does but I wasn't going to say it

[13:43:04]

dustybin:

im going to start buying parts for server / backend http://paste.debian.net/61618/plain/61618

[13:43:44]

skd5aner:

I'm playing with "foremost" to see if it'll recover the file, interesting

[13:43:46]

dustybin:

ive been using the same frontend / backend box ever since ive started using linux

[13:44:06]

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[13:47:58]

oobe:

dustybin, why you choosing a board with ati IGP

[13:49:02]

dustybin:

oobe: this is a server box only, not a frontend, i require a mobo with nothing fancy built in gfx

[13:49:32]

oobe:

oh then you can spend less that board has a lot of bells and whistles that you wont use

[13:49:44]

dustybin:

the latest intel boards require either a expensive CPU with built in gfx, or a less expensive CPU and a extra graphic card

[13:50:28]

dustybin:

oobe: the cheaper board is the 785, buts its only £25 cheaper

[13:52:29]

dustybin:

oobe: check out the reviews: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.a . . . E16813128398

[13:54:25]

oobe:

ok i looked recently at boards myself but had completely different priority's i wanted a AMD cpu and onboard hdmi that supports alsa

[13:54:33]

oobe:

and vdpau

[13:54:46]

oobe:

i found one but im thinking i dont need to upgrade anymore

[13:55:34]

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[13:55:58]

oobe:

this board was what i wanted http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Products/Motherboa . . . oductID=3281

[13:56:39]

oobe:

very cheap and has onboard graphics hdmi alsa supported and nvidia vdpau supported

[13:56:52]

oobe:

but i know you have completly different needs

[13:57:18]

dustybin:

that board looks good

[13:57:27]

dustybin:

oobe: is that for a frontend / backend combo /

[13:57:28]

dustybin:

?

[13:58:27]

oobe:

just a frontend

[13:58:39]

dustybin:

im thinking about getting one of these for frontend only

[13:58:41]

dustybin:

http://zotac.com/index.php?option=com_wrapper . . . &lang=un

[13:58:55]

oobe:

the board is very cheap

[13:59:14]

dustybin:

aye ok

[13:59:17]

oobe:

i have seen it for more elsewhere but i can get it for $78 aud

[13:59:26]

dustybin:

nice

[13:59:30]

dustybin:

what about a case?

[13:59:52]

oobe:

that was the only thing i hadnt chosen

[14:00:00]

dustybin:

cases can be expensive

[14:00:04]

dustybin:

especially nice ones

[14:00:05]

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[14:00:13]

oobe:

anyway im probably not going to do it as i dont have the money anymore

[14:00:18]

dustybin:

aye ok

[14:00:29]

oobe:

plus its meant to replace a machine that plays fine

[14:00:41]

oobe:

just a little laggy going through the menus

[14:00:53]

oobe:

with newer themes

[14:00:59]

dustybin:

im running out of storage space on my combo box, its time for a change

[14:01:18]

oobe:

yeah i been meaning to buy more HDD's

[14:01:35]

oobe:

i am worried about one of my disks

[14:01:40]

dustybin:

1.5TB seem to be good value for money at the moment

[14:02:13]

oobe:

yea its cheaper for me to buy 1.5TB x 2 than one 2TB well about the same price

[14:02:47]

oobe:

its the same price to buy 1.5tb and 1tb as a 2tb

[14:03:37]

oobe:

i am going to replace my /home and / with the 1tb and use the rest of the space to replace my recordings and take my old drive out

[14:03:50]

oobe:

then add another 1.5tb for mythvideo

[14:04:04]

skd5aner:

hmmm... foremost isn't finding any of the deleted .mpg, probably because it doesn't start with the exact hex code it's looking for

[14:04:18]

skd5aner:

it found all the png, jpg for the previews

[14:04:30]

skd5aner:

a ton of them

[14:04:36]

skd5aner:

oh well, it was worth a short

[14:04:38]

skd5aner:

shot

[14:04:39]

oobe:

what you talking about skd5aner

[14:05:51]

skd5aner:

oobe: scroll up :)

[14:06:12]

skd5aner:

12:20

[14:06:17]

skd5aner:

(EST)

[14:06:33]

oobe:

what fs was it on

[14:06:38]

skd5aner:

xfs

[14:06:44]

oobe:

xfs is very hard to recover

[14:07:46]

skd5aner:

I was trying "foremost" – but the requirements to find an mpg are this: "mpg Support for most MPEG files (must begin with 0x000001BA)

[14:07:59]

skd5aner:

it did find a ton of the deleted png and jpg files

[14:08:06]

skd5aner:

but none of the mpgs

[14:10:19]

oobe:

i never heard of foremost

[14:10:20]

skd5aner:

ultimately, if it's gone it's gone – It's not that important, it's just an excersise of experimenting now for fun

[14:10:31]

skd5aner:

me either till google told me about it 40 mins ago

[14:10:59]

oobe:

i spent a little bit of time reading about xfs delete recovery when i accidently deleted a show i would never find online

[14:11:10]

skd5aner:

yea? any luck?

[14:11:17]

oobe:

no

[14:11:24]

skd5aner:

figures :)

[14:11:33]

oobe:

i found a wiki page talking about the theory

[14:11:50]

oobe:

and the amount of difficulty and low success rate

[14:11:58]

oobe:

then i found a howto i didnt really understand

[14:12:08]

skd5aner:

oh well – life goes on, it's just TV :)

[14:12:09]

oobe:

but i dont remember cause i didnt spend a lot of time on it

[14:13:08]

oobe:

dustybin, this looks awesome http://www.amazon.com/Zotac-MAG-Mini-Barebone . . . p/B00336EET6

[14:13:11]

wagnerrp:

skd5aner: basically, the hardest problem with 'undelete' is that if the blocks are not sequential, youre boned

[14:13:21]

oobe:

im assuming you need to add cpu and ram as it says barebone

[14:13:58]

wagnerrp:

how is that a 'barebone'?

[14:14:04]

wagnerrp:

ALL IONs come with a processor

[14:14:16]

wagnerrp:

this one also seems to come with memory and a hard drive

[14:14:21]

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[14:14:29]

wagnerrp:

the ONLY thing its lacking is an operating system

[14:14:42]

wagnerrp:

that hardly qualifies

[14:14:43]

dustybin:

which is a good thing

[14:15:12]

dustybin:

htpc cases are _expensive_

[14:15:20]

oobe:

sorry i misread it

[14:15:25]

dustybin:

some are probably more than that zotac mag

[14:15:31]

wagnerrp:

no, you read it right

[14:15:33]

skd5aner:

some are, some aren't

[14:15:33]

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[14:15:38]

wagnerrp:

they called it a 'barebones' system

[14:15:43]

wagnerrp:

which is completely misleading

[14:16:05]

oobe:

no i did cause i couldnt see the cpu and ram specs straight off

[14:16:11]

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[14:16:27]

oobe:

and the price was so cheap i assumed it was missing stuff

[14:16:38]

dustybin:

i wonder if that zotac box passes the justinh test :D

[14:16:48]

dustybin:

..probably not

[14:17:15]

dustybin:

the only thing its lacking is a infra red port, but i dont think thats a problem

[14:21:41]

oobe:

the process is 1.6GHz single core

[14:22:07]

oobe:

has 4x usb so you could add a remote that way

[14:22:28]

oobe:

but 1.6GHz cpu means vdpau better work for all content

[14:22:42]

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[14:22:44]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: isn't the only thing that makes a system barebones is the lack of hard drives?

[14:23:21]

wagnerrp:

kormoc: i generally took it to mean case, power supply, motherboard, maybe a processor

[14:23:51]

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[14:24:56]

wagnerrp:

seems to be the consensus on newegg

[14:25:01]

oobe:

the barebone systems i am thinking off are those shuttle cases with builtin psu + mobo no ram no cpu

[14:25:15]

wagnerrp:

the only machines which have processors are the Atom systems, which cant not have a processor

[14:25:41]

wagnerrp:

not many end users who are going to be soldering on a BGA chip

[14:26:33]

oobe:

lol

[14:29:01]

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[14:37:01]

shadash:

would this work as a good frontend/backend system? http://www.aleutia.com/products/h1

[14:37:45]

wagnerrp:

sure, but why bother paying the markup?

[14:38:13]

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[14:38:26]

shadash:

sometimes $$$ is worth less than time

[14:38:37]

shadash:

plus you have someone to bitch to

[14:39:26]

Beirdo:

oh not this again :)

[14:39:31]

wagnerrp:

thats a $160 motherboard and processor, a $40 case, and $80 of memory

[14:39:37]

wagnerrp:

you can buy all of that on your own

[14:39:43]

wagnerrp:

and install it in 5 minutes

[14:40:00]

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[14:40:17]

shadash:

or I could go to the beach and not have the hassle

[14:40:34]

wagnerrp:

thats practically half price

[14:41:07]

shadash:

I agree

[14:41:15]

wagnerrp:

(actually a good deal of the cost of that thing is the SSD, which is of little use to mythtv)

[14:41:15]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: to be fair, I buy apple products, so it seems silly to argue with him about markup ;)

[14:41:38]

wagnerrp:

kormoc: at least you get a decent processor out of the deal

[14:41:45]

** kormoc laughs **

[14:41:47]

kormoc:

fair 'nuff

[14:42:17]

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[14:43:25]

wagnerrp:

to be honest, those mac mini's really arent that overpriced

[14:43:33]

wagnerrp:

if you consider theyre built using laptop hardware

[14:43:43]

kormoc:

tis true

[14:44:08]

kormoc:

$800 for a 4 gigs of ram, dvd-rw, core 2 duo laptop isn't horrible

[14:44:22]

shadash:

aghh... im not paying vat

[14:44:45]

kormoc:

gonna leave the motherland?

[14:44:59]

shadash:

california

[14:45:06]

** kormoc blinks **

[14:45:12]

kormoc:

California has VAT now?

[14:45:26]

wagnerrp:

no, hes trying to buy off a british website

[14:45:29]

shadash:

no not yet

[14:45:47]

** kormoc laughs **

[14:45:56]

kormoc:

wow, that's a silly thing to do

[14:46:09]

kormoc:

E350 is as much as a mac mini...

[14:46:59]

shadash:

anyone know if theres another place to buy a H1 Hotel PC?

[14:48:29]

shadash:

My plans is to get a H1 Hotel PC run it as a frontend/backend + plug in 2TB of usb storage

[14:48:54]

shadash:

but it looks like I'm going to have to assemble myself

[14:52:37]

shadash:

any other suggestions for a complete system that's assembled + ready to go?

[14:57:38]

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[15:01:38]

drmacro:

how do I determine if/what is avaialble on a firewire connection to my cable box?

[15:03:27]

iamlindoro:

trial and error

[15:03:39]

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[15:04:52]

drmacro:

Don't have a problem with trial and erro...but I don't know what to 'trial'

[15:05:51]

iamlindoro:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/FireWire

[15:06:21]

iamlindoro:

Switch your cable box to a broadcast channel like NBC to ahve the best shot while testing

[15:06:40]

iamlindoro:

if you can't get the connection to stabilize on that, odds are you will be unable to capture anything via firewire

[15:06:55]

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[15:07:12]

iamlindoro:

if you do get it to stabilize, then you can add it to myth and see if you can get any video, and which channels hang

[15:07:34]

iamlindoro:

Depending on where you are and who your provider is, results will vary. In general, expect to get nothing

[15:10:09]

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[15:10:19]

Beirdo:

expect to pay too much for nothing. Welcome to capitalism ;)

[15:10:32]

Beirdo:

am I cynical today? :)

[15:11:03]

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[15:11:14]

kormoc:

%s/today// :P

[15:11:30]

Beirdo:

heh

[15:11:33]

Beirdo:

OK then

[15:11:43]

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[15:12:15]

drmacro:

Probably, but I just put the Myth system together and have no tuner card. HEck, I stil need to hook the hdmi to my tv...

[15:13:31]

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[15:17:07]

drmacro:

if I select Watch tv it says myth is using all inputs but there are no active recordings

[15:18:21]

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[15:18:21]

iamlindoro:

There is no way you went through the entire process of the firewire wiki page in the last ten minutes

[15:18:39]

iamlindoro:

and sounds like you didn't bother to import channels either, indicating basic Myth setup fail

[15:19:11]

iamlindoro:

read your backend logs, but more importantly, read the myth documentation carefully

[15:19:47]

iamlindoro:

Top guesses would be you didn't set up a schedules direct account, lineups, download channels, and attach them to the input OR permissions issues on your recording dirs

[15:28:10]

drmacro:

Correct, that error message was before my first post,

[15:28:51]

jarle:

Anybody have experience having mythtv and xmbc (or boxee) running at the same time, preventing them from blocking the audio?

[15:29:08]

drmacro:

schedule direct account failed during Myth install because I don't use dhcp and install doesn't give option for manual ip setup,

[15:29:44]

drmacro:

have to find out how to get schedule to run again. and first thing ai tried from the wiki said it isn't installed.

[15:40:45]

drmacro:

plugreport doesn't run, says it's in libiec61883-dev; synatic doesn't show libiec61883-dev, apt- get can't find it, what repo is it in?

[15:42:05]

iamlindoro:

drmacro: you should ask in #ubuntu-mythtv, we don't handle packager issues here

[15:42:16]

iamlindoro:

(or myth distro specific issues)

[15:45:02]

drmacro:

synaptic yes, but they handle apt-get issues?

[15:45:34]

iamlindoro:

yes, since they are the ones who packaged it

[15:45:53]

iamlindoro:

we don't provide myth packages-- we provide myth source. Nothing having to do with distros, etc.

[15:48:51]

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[15:51:59]

yalu:

oobe: not risk, risc... meaning a cpu with a small number of instructions which runs faster through its instruction sets allowing similar speed at a lower clock frequency (compared to cisc)

[15:52:40]

oobe:

thanks someone else explained that well not in so much detail

[15:53:05]

oobe:

i would try it there is no harm in that

[15:53:24]

oobe:

there are ppc distros and ligh wieght ones too

[15:54:14]

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[15:57:35]

J-e-f-f-A:

Hehehe... "I just ordered parts..." <-- I felt like responding "Congratulations!" ...

[16:04:09]

yalu:

oobe: well it's just that I want to chek if it would be worth the effort. since I'll have to look up how to boot them from from etc. it should be straightforward (press C during boot), but that hasn't worked so far.

[16:04:16]

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[16:08:21]

oobe:

boot them?

[16:08:27]

oobe:

you mean the install cd's

[16:08:56]

oobe:

yeah i cant help you with that sort of thing simply cause i dont use macs

[16:14:13]

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[16:17:48]

EnderTheThird:

Are the ttvdb.py and tmdb.py scripts supposed to be working in SVN trunk now? I know [23355] made some changes to match the new API, but was that supposed to be enough to get them working again?

[16:18:10]

wagnerrp:

yes, they should work

[16:18:35]

wagnerrp:

what problem are you having with them?

[16:18:40]

EnderTheThird:

Hmmm, were there any new python dependencies or anything? Mine's worked a few times, but now I keep getting errors.

[16:18:43]

yalu:

oobe: you are forgiven for that ;-) the nowadays intel macs are easier too... they use EFI.

[16:19:09]

wagnerrp:

sort of

[16:19:33]

wagnerrp:

they both use separate libraries for accessing their respective APIs

[16:19:44]

oobe:

i did notice a distro called slackintosh which is meant to run well on older hardware its very minimal if you want it to be

[16:19:45]

wagnerrp:

and those libraries got moved into the main python bindings

[16:19:56]

wagnerrp:

so they could be pulled by other tools

[16:20:18]

wagnerrp:

such as the tmdb trailer grabber in mnv

[16:21:07]

EnderTheThird:

Hmm, well now the FE is being a jerk to start up at all, heh.

[16:21:45]

RDV_Linux:

EnderTheThird: Could you be specific what the issue is and provide a pastebin to an error from a FE log or running from a terminal.

[16:21:48]

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[16:22:41]

EnderTheThird:

Yeah, I think the FE error is because I was compiling fixes for another machine and it might have installed by accident. I'll post if it stays like this

[16:25:02]

EnderTheThird:

OK, FE is fine again, but I get the following when trying to download metadata: http://pastebin.ca/1812323

[16:25:22]

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[16:25:23]

EnderTheThird:

this is on 64-bit Ubuntu 9.10, r23601

[16:25:33]

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[16:28:09]

RDV_Linux:

EnderTheThird: Run '/usr/local/share/mythtv/mythvideo/scripts/Television/ttvdb.py -l en -M "Modern Family"' a terminal and you will see an error.

[16:28:09]

wagnerrp:

hehehe

[16:28:28]

wagnerrp:

yeah, you need to install the python bindings for mythtv

[16:29:09]

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[16:29:55]

EnderTheThird:

wagnerrp: I figured I'd have had all of them from when I was running 0.22-fixes, but that shows how little I know. ;-) are they included in trunk somewhere or can i get them via apt?

[16:30:02]

RDV_Linux:

EnderTheThird: What is happening is that an abort message is being interrupted by MythVideo as a matching TV Series. I personally did not think that happened, but...

[16:30:17]

wagnerrp:

the bindings were rewritten completely in trunk

[16:33:12]

EnderTheThird:

RDV_Linux. Ran " '/usr/local/share/mythtv/mythvideo/scripts/Television/ttvdb.py' -l en -M "Modern Family" " from terminal and no errors

[16:33:32]

EnderTheThird:

wagnerrp: I see there's a "bindings" folder in mythv from trunk. I need to use that to update them?

[16:34:33]

RDV_Linux:

Well the second use of ttvdb in the pastebin shows "They should have been installed along with the MythTV python bindings." as the tv series name and that is an error message.

[16:35:40]

EnderTheThird:

RDV_Linux: http://pastebin.ca/1812336

[16:35:56]

RDV_Linux:

EnderTheThird: Get your trunk bindings installed and that should fix this issue.

[16:36:03]

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[16:36:49]

RDV_Linux:

EnderTheThird: That last pastebin looks good so I am not sure why the second ttvdb call is such a mess.

[16:37:07]

skd5aner:

is there going to be an official freeze for trunk prior to release?

[16:37:30]

RDV_Linux:

skd5aner: I thought it was already in effect

[16:37:50]

RDV_Linux:

feature dreeze at the least

[16:38:07]

EnderTheThird:

There we go. I rebuilt bindings and restarted myth. Seems to be working find. Thanks for the help. I had assumed running make from the mythtv dir would run subdir's including bindings. Guess not.

[16:38:07]

RDV_Linux:

s/dreeze/freeze/

[16:38:30]

wagnerrp:

yes, the freeze has been in effect for about a week and a half

[16:39:54]

EnderTheThird:

Hmmm, it's not downloading screenshot images though. http://pastebin.ca/1812339

[16:40:17]

wagnerrp:

youre trying to download to a directory that does not exist

[16:40:27]

wagnerrp:

create it, and make sure mythfrontend has write access to it

[16:41:39]

EnderTheThird:

Crap, just noticed the typo in mythtv-setup. *facepalm*

[16:42:02]

EnderTheThird:

I'd been checking permissions on that stupid folder the last 10 times and pulling my hair out

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[16:51:01]

psipsi:

iamlindoro: what's the status on the theme competition?

[16:51:40]

wagnerrp:

huh... two identical questions at nearly the same time in different channels

[16:52:01]

psipsi:

yeah... we are talking on another channel ;)

[16:52:07]

psipsi:

great minds

[16:53:49]

iamlindoro:

The status is that submissions are closed and voting has not begun

[16:54:15]

psipsi:

ok, thanks

[16:57:39]

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[16:57:52]

steadyeddie:

do I need to stop the BE before running the restore script?

[16:57:58]

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[16:58:37]

wagnerrp:

what restore script?

[16:59:02]

steadyeddie:

sorry, mythconverg

[16:59:20]

wagnerrp:

mythconverg is the default database name, not a restore script

[16:59:40]

wagnerrp:

i assume youre talking about the packaged backup/restore perl script

[16:59:45]

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[16:59:53]

wagnerrp:

in which case, yes, mythtv needs to be completely offline when that is restoring

[16:59:58]

steadyeddie:

yes

[17:00:11]

steadyeddie:

ok thanks

[17:00:21]

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[17:00:29]

wagnerrp:

to be honest, i dont know what woudl happen if the backend is active

[17:00:38]

wagnerrp:

but it would not function properly anyway until it were restarted

[17:01:01]

steadyeddie:

well I wouldn't want to find out

[17:04:30]

KaZeR:

anyone here using DVB-S? i'm having issues with channels scanning

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[17:28:40]

shadash:

neat I just figured out how to use a hex editor :-)

[17:28:58]

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[17:34:36]

squish102:

was the hauppauge hvr-2250 card not a favorite for this channel?

[17:34:49]

squish102:

well supported in mythtv?

[17:35:07]

wagnerrp:

its not supported by mythtv

[17:35:13]

wagnerrp:

its supported by v4l-dvb

[17:35:26]

squish102:

well?

[17:35:27]

wagnerrp:

and mythtv in turn supports the v4l and dvb apis

[17:35:41]

stevieman:

2 quick questions, is it possible to change the mythtranscode option for a recorded video? and 2 is there a way to automate mythtranscode? I select the auto transcode and nothing happens, I go into mythweb and select the the transcode option for the recording and it transcodes just fine

[17:35:47]

wagnerrp:

so if it is listed as supported on linuxtv.org, you can use it with mythtv

[17:36:09]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: I'm not sure that's really a fair statement. In reality, there *are* cards that are supported by v4l-dvb, which do not work under MythTV. So it's a perfectly reasonable question as to whether a card works under MythTV.

[17:36:49]

wagnerrp:

devinheitmueller: well there are a couple exceptions, but those are all non-standard cards arent they?

[17:37:01]

wagnerrp:

stuff like the HVR-1800/1850 which need special code to manage

[17:37:03]

devinheitmueller:

But to answer squish102's question, yes, the 2250 does work under MythTV, but bear in mind only the digital side of the card has driver support (the analog support is not implemented).

[17:37:07]

wagnerrp:

since theyre not a v4l framegrabber

[17:38:01]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: from an API standpoint, any card that is supported in v4l-dvb *should* work under MythTV. But the combination of MythTV doing some dumb things in its code and bugs in the drivers, it cannot be guaranteed.

[17:39:00]

devinheitmueller:

I've had a number of cases where I've had cards that worked in other applications, and then had to do additional work to get them to work under MythTV (as MythTV can expose bugs in the drivers that other applications do not).

[17:39:58]

devinheitmueller:

The 1800/1850 situation is one such example. The analog support for that card does work in general (for example, it works with tvtime). But work needs to be done to fix the edge cases that MythTV happens to expose.

[17:40:21]

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[17:40:47]

squish102:

thanks devinheitmueller, i saw it on special, but if the analog doesn't work it is not that special

[17:41:09]

wagnerrp:

just out of curiosity, could the 1800 be used as a framegrabber in mythtv? or is the bug elsewhere?

[17:41:33]

devinheitmueller:

wagnerrp: the bug is in common code to both the MPEG portion or the frame grabber.

[17:42:02]

stevieman:

Is there a way to change the transcoding quality of a already recorded video?

[17:42:04]

devinheitmueller:

And most people wouldn't find the framegrabber very useful at this point, since KernelLabs changes for ALSA audio support haven't been merged (hence you would be able to do raw video but have no ability to get the audio)

[17:42:08]

squish102:

http://www.buy.com/prod/hauppauge-wintv-hvr-2 . . . 8809706.html Hauppauge WINTV-HVR-2250 Dual TV Tuner/Encoder $79.99 after rebate

[17:42:24]

squish102:

if anyone else is interested

[17:42:31]

wagnerrp:

thats a hell of a deal

[17:42:49]

wagnerrp:

thats a pretty good price just to get two digital tuners

[17:43:12]

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[17:43:19]

squish102:

well i picked up an hd-homerun for the same price, and think i probably would prefer that

[17:43:33]

wagnerrp:

really? lowest ive seen is ~$110

[17:43:51]

squish102:

blackfriday at radio shack. limited special

[17:44:08]

wagnerrp:

yeah, the 110 was black friday at newegg

[17:44:15]

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[17:44:18]

squish102:

but this card, i was thinking, would replace my pvr-150

[17:44:35]

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[17:44:51]

devinheitmueller:

Yeah, that's a pretty good price for that card.

[17:44:55]

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[17:47:18]

squish102:

now that i have connected a few tuners to one box, i guess there is a place that i can put priority on which tuner i want to use first to record and also which channels (HD before SD)?

[17:47:58]

wagnerrp:

just add the tuners in the order you want them to be used

[17:48:40]

wagnerrp:

you can fiddle with priorities, but doing so generally has unintended consequences

[17:48:47]

squish102:

I think i have got the hd-homerun to have a higher priority, but then they still record 'DT' instead of 'HD'

[17:49:36]

squish102:

ok, so clear them all out, and add them back in the order of priority

[17:49:37]

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[17:49:51]

squish102:

because atm, it is in the complete opposite

[17:49:54]

wagnerrp:

thats the recommended solution for most situations

[17:50:06]

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[17:51:48]

squish102:

would i have to rescan my channels, or will they still stay there (I hate having to type in all the xmltvid's in again)

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[18:13:47]

martin___:

Hi there! I have a problem with mythvideo I can't figure out. I have a setup with one backend and two frontends. I use storage groups. When I do a "scan for changes", the metadata is inserted in the db but nothing is listed in mythvideo

[18:14:01]

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[18:14:49]

martin___:

Browsing and playing videos using file browse mode works as expected, though

[18:16:25]

martin___:

Also, doing another scan for changes inserts duplicate data in the db.

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[18:45:04]

oobe:

martin___, are you using an old version of mythtv this sounds like behaviour that was fixed around .22 release time

[18:46:10]

martin___:

oobe: ok, I'm using mythbuntu.

[18:49:04]

martin___:

oobe: mythbackend says: mythbackend version: branches/release-0-22-fixes [22594]

[18:49:17]

iamlindoro:

22594 is pre-.22

[18:49:38]

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[18:49:49]

iamlindoro:

You should upgrade to current fixes using mythbuntu nightly builds

[18:50:19]

martin___:

iamlindoro: ok, thans! I'll have a go at it.

[18:50:52]

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[18:58:00]

oobe:

iamlindoro, video tree remembers last postition works for me now without storage groups since i last rebuilt fixes

[18:58:33]

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[19:01:05]

oobe:

was that intentional or just a by product of the one of the last changes in 23604

[19:02:33]

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[19:12:22]

GreyFoxx:

heheh this s awesome... my powers out so I'm using my car charger battery to run my cable modem, laptop and linksys router

[19:12:31]

GreyFoxx:

wonder how many minutes I'll get off this.

[19:12:42]

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[19:12:51]

oobe:

wait its nothing to do with recent changes to fixes it is when i enable file browse mode

[19:14:10]

iamlindoro:

oobe, That's because file browse mode doesn't use an invisible root node-- nothing has changed

[19:14:47]

oobe:

ok still handy that it somewhat works

[19:15:28]

oobe:

however now it remembers last position of gallery and browse etc.

[19:16:01]

oobe:

i used to use it to stay in a particular series using tree and play other content using gallery

[19:16:04]

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[19:16:20]

oobe:

then i could switch back and fourth easily

[19:17:01]

oobe:

gl GreyFoxx hope ur power is back on soon

[19:17:35]

kormoc:

GreyFoxx: I estimate 135 minutes

[19:20:20]

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[19:23:00]

wagnerrp:

squish102: channels are bound to the source, not the tuner

[19:23:09]

wagnerrp:

you only have to mess with the channels if you delete the source

[19:23:51]

wagnerrp:

your car charger has a battery?

[19:24:06]

wagnerrp:

or do you mean one of those plugin emergency starters

[19:24:10]

squish102:

ok thanks wagnerrp... too late because i must have screwed something up, and now have to manually enter in about 30 xmltvids again :(

[19:25:47]

GreyFoxx:

kormoc: I would be happily suprised :)

[19:26:08]

GreyFoxx:

though I have already exceeded my expectation

[19:26:42]

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[19:28:09]

kormoc:

GreyFoxx: car batteries hold *a lot* of energy, all things considered

[19:29:10]

GreyFoxx:

ahh , its not actually the battery, but one of those portable battery packs for jumping a battery with a couple power plugs built in

[19:29:19]

GreyFoxx:

so I have no idea how much power is in it

[19:29:24]

GreyFoxx:

been 22 minutes so far

[19:29:48]

kormoc:

ahh

[19:31:39]

wagnerrp:

well how heavy is it compared to a car battery?

[19:31:56]

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[19:32:32]

wagnerrp:

heres one with a 20Ah battery

[19:32:44]

wagnerrp:

so about 1/4–1/5 the capacity of a normal car battery

[19:33:28]

wagnerrp:

should get several hours of use out of it at least

[19:34:02]

wagnerrp:

your average laptop battery is about 5Ah

[19:36:24]

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[19:37:04]

GreyFoxx:

wagnerrp: not as heavy... maybe half to 3 quarters

[19:37:35]

GreyFoxx:

since mybattery is crap I took it out so the system wasn't constantly trying to charge it

[19:37:46]

GreyFoxx:

and set the laptop to low power mode

[19:37:55]

GreyFoxx:

and with the lights off the dimmer screen is more than fine

[19:40:58]

GreyFoxx:

makes mewant a generator for the house even more :)

[19:41:13]

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[19:42:17]

Brad-D:

hey guys, can you offer any advice on why this nfs mount might be slow? 192.168.1.3:/var/drive2/Myth2/Recordings /var/nfs/Rec1/ nfs rw,rsize=32768,wsize=32768,soft,intr,nfsvers=3,tcp,noatime,nodev,async,lock 0 0

[19:42:27]

kormoc:

Generators and faraday cages!

[19:42:49]

kormoc:

Brad-D: why lock?

[19:43:16]

Brad-D:

kormoc: because i googled how to do an nfs mount, and the website i visited had it in? :)

[19:43:24]

bjd:

nooooooo

[19:43:24]

kormoc:

remove that

[19:43:39]

bjd:

make sure you understand everything you copy and paste

[19:43:42]

wagnerrp:

Brad-D: is this for a slave backend?

[19:43:47]

Brad-D:

thanks, will do that.

[19:44:06]

kormoc:

(I'd also remove intr , but doubt it'd help speed wise)

[19:44:11]

Brad-D:

wagnerrp: i did have a slave backend running on this server, but with the nfs mounts i found i didn't need it?

[19:44:17]

Brad-D:

so i stopped booting up the slave backend

[19:44:20]

Brad-D:

i have no tunerso n htatm achine

[19:44:25]

Brad-D:

kormoc: thanks i will do that

[19:44:40]

wagnerrp:

why would you need a slave backend if you had no tuners?

[19:44:59]

kormoc:

bjd: hey now, tuning by google is part of why I can charge so much! ;)

[19:45:20]

kormoc:

go into a place, remove all the inane options that slows crap down, look like a hero

[19:45:28]

bjd:

=)

[19:45:40]

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[19:45:51]

Brad-D:

wagnerrp: well my thought was that i could use it to add additional storage for recordings to my main server (which ran out of space).. i thought i needed that second server to run mythbackend too.. but hten people siad just use NFS and don't muck around with second mythbackend

[19:45:54]

wagnerrp:

Brad-D: if you are not running a slave backend on the machine, just remove the mount all together

[19:45:57]

wagnerrp:

its completely unneeded

[19:46:29]

Brad-D:

but i still want to store some of my recordings on that machine, as i ran out of space?

[19:46:50]

wagnerrp:

so youre running the master backend on that machine

[19:47:11]

Brad-D:

i'm running the master backend (5tb on one machine), and i put up a second server with 6 tb, to serve as additional storage

[19:47:21]

Brad-D:

no tuners or anything on the second server, i just needed more hard drive space

[19:47:36]

wagnerrp:

and why isnt it mounted in the same place on both systems?

[19:48:09]

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[19:48:10]

wagnerrp:

if you run a frontend on the remote storage

[19:48:15]

Brad-D:

sorry, i'm confused about what you are asking

[19:48:21]

wagnerrp:

it will end up streaming over backend protocol, over the nfs share

[19:48:21]

Brad-D:

yes i do run a frontend on the remote storage

[19:48:30]

wagnerrp:

because the file isnt where the frontend expects it to be

[19:48:45]

wagnerrp:

even though the file is available on the local hard drive

[19:48:46]

Brad-D:

hmm good point

[19:48:50]

Brad-D:

so the optimal setting is?

[19:49:16]

wagnerrp:

optimal setting is to have all storage paths available in the same place on all backends

[19:49:36]

wagnerrp:

shared over nfs

[19:50:25]

wagnerrp:

hopefully by 0.24 or 0.25, the nfs requirement will be removed

[19:50:36]

wagnerrp:

and mythtv will simply record to any available file server over mythprotocol

[19:51:18]

wagnerrp:

the capability is all there, but the storage and balancing code has to be rewritten to use it

[19:51:25]

Brad-D:

i feel like the dumb kid here, hehe.. sorry to be slow! So i should run mythbackend on both machines (despite the fact that one doesn't have a tuner), then set up the same directory structure on both, and nfs mount to the drives that aren't local

[19:51:42]

wagnerrp:

no, only run the backend on the machines you have storage on

[19:51:56]

wagnerrp:

my comment before was based under the expectation that most people only have storage on their backend

[19:52:38]

wagnerrp:

make that 'all machines that have recording storage and run some form of mythtv program should have the storage mounted in the same location'

[19:53:07]

wagnerrp:

for instance... make them all mount to /mnt/mythtv/<machine name>/<partition number>/

[19:53:11]

Brad-D:

so if on my mythbackend i have a storage group /brad/storage/ and i try to play a video on the front end.. it will look locally for /brad/storage/ (which will be nfs mounted)?

[19:53:31]

wagnerrp:

backends need NFS access to all partitions they want to write to

[19:53:49]

wagnerrp:

frontends can stream from the backend, if the file is not found locally

[19:54:05]

wagnerrp:

so dont bother mounting anything on the remote frontend

[19:54:19]

wagnerrp:

just have the storage on the remote frontend be in the same location that the backend sees it

[19:54:40]

wagnerrp:

so the frontend can find and access the file locally rather than have to pull it from the backend

[19:54:48]

Brad-D:

ahh okay, i think i get it now

[19:55:08]

Brad-D:

so a frontend, will look to the storage group dir locally.. if it finds it, it plays locally, if it doesn't, it goes the the mythbackend streaming?

[19:55:17]

wagnerrp:

correct

[19:55:40]

wagnerrp:

which in your case, would result in sending the same data both directions over the network

[19:55:50]

Brad-D:

thanks wagnerrp, i appreciate you walking me through that really slowly, hehehe

[19:55:51]

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[19:56:42]

jarle:

doesn't seem like mythtv is able to tune my new dvb-s2 card (Hauppauge! Win-TV Nove s2) Is there a trick to this?

[19:56:51]

Brad-D:

so in terms of best practices, how do you manage all your directories. similar to the /mnt/mythtv/machinename structure you gave above?

[19:57:46]

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[19:58:06]

wagnerrp:

the above is how i do my directories

[19:58:18]

wagnerrp:

i used to have several disks shared between two backends

[19:58:26]

wagnerrp:

but at the moment, its all on one machine

[19:58:31]

wagnerrp:

so it doesnt really matter any more

[19:59:12]

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[19:59:20]

dustybin:

can a dvb-s2 card pick up dvb-s ?

[19:59:41]

wagnerrp:

if it says it can, yes

[20:00:01]

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[20:00:09]

wagnerrp:

simply supporting S2 doesnt necessarily mean it can do S

[20:00:10]

dustybin:

ace

[20:00:13]

dustybin:

ok

[20:00:28]

high-rez:

I think every dvb-s2 card I've seen also works with dvb-s...

[20:00:51]

dustybin:

double ace :D

[20:00:52]

wagnerrp:

theres no reason for them not to

[20:01:44]

dustybin:

i could keep my hauppauge dual nova-t tuner and get a hauppage dual nova-s2 tuner for hd channels

[20:01:44]

high-rez:

Not sure where you are, but in the states dvb-s2 is almost completely useless. I think there's a couple of DVB-S2 feeds, but not much. :)

[20:01:50]

wagnerrp:

hes a brit

[20:02:02]

high-rez:

Lucky. :/

[20:02:13]

dustybin:

we can only get HD via sat here

[20:02:18]

dustybin:

or cable maybe/!

[20:02:25]

dustybin:

and SKY crap

[20:02:26]

jduggan:

or freeview

[20:02:34]

dustybin:

freesat

[20:02:41]

jduggan:

freeview shortly

[20:02:43]

jduggan:

if not already

[20:02:44]

jduggan:

;]

[20:02:56]

dustybin:

i thought there wasnt enough bandwidth?

[20:02:56]

high-rez:

At least some of the .eu providers like you use the CI in pci cards/usb cards.

[20:03:17]

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[20:03:51]

dustybin:

jduggan: would i require a new dvb-t card for that?

[20:04:09]

dustybin:

dvb-t2 if there is such a thing

[20:04:53]

dustybin:

http://www.freeview.co.uk/freeview/Services/Freeview-HD2

[20:04:54]

high-rez:

(I've always wondered how much of it was actually possible – i saw technisat sells interfaces, but I wonder if many providers actually allow you to use them in the hardware of your choice in europe?)

[20:05:38]

dustybin:

wow

[20:05:39]

dustybin:

http://www.freeview.co.uk/blog/

[20:06:30]

dustybin:

i better hurry up and build my new server :D

[20:06:44]

dustybin:

and save up for a LED backlit HDTV

[20:07:15]

dustybin:

and a zotac mag :D

[20:07:20]

jduggan:

shrug

[20:07:24]

jduggan:

i dont chase technology

[20:07:30]

jduggan:

waste of money

[20:07:36]

jduggan:

when im ready i'll sort it out

[20:07:40]

jduggan:

might be another 2 years ;]

[20:07:47]

bjd:

fail, HD in 2011

[20:08:22]

dustybin:

everybody will be talking about UHD in 2011

[20:09:12]

dustybin:

if you watch a film on SD or a film on HD, after a few minutes of watching the film, you will not realise if its SD or HD

[20:09:40]

wagnerrp:

why would you want UHD?

[20:09:47]

dustybin:

your brain gets used to whatever

[20:09:52]

dustybin:

Ultra HD :P

[20:10:08]

wagnerrp:

your eye cant process UHD

[20:10:13]

dustybin:

:D

[20:10:26]

jduggan:

my box cant process HD

[20:10:29]

dustybin:

wagnerrp: it can if the screen is 500ft x 500ft :D

[20:10:38]

wagnerrp:

not at a range you would normally watch TV at, at a size you might put in a home

[20:10:59]

dustybin:

in a few years, google will be streaming tv straight into your homes

[20:11:07]

dustybin:

then you will not require mythtv

[20:11:15]

wagnerrp:

nevermind the fact that recording and editing 8K video would be ridiculously expensive

[20:11:16]

jduggan:

i quite happily enjoyed movies on vhs

[20:11:18]

jduggan:

fuck hd

[20:11:19]

jduggan:

=]

[20:11:47]

iamlindoro:

jduggan, you have been around WAY too long to not know about profanity rules in this channel

[20:11:55]

jduggan:

iamlindoro: apologise

[20:11:56]

jduggan:

=]

[20:12:35]

iamlindoro:

I'm not irritated, but I want to be clear that the next time will come with a kick. since the rules apply to everyone

[20:12:50]

jduggan:

yea

[20:12:53]

jduggan:

agree

[20:12:54]

kormoc:

I've even kicked myself for it!

[20:12:58]

jduggan:

:)

[20:13:10]

bjd:

heh

[20:13:26]

dustybin:

jduggan: do a search for the 'f' word here: http://mythtv.beirdo.ca/ircLog/channel/1/2008-09-07

[20:13:29]

bjd:

it's quite strange, this is the only channel i'm in that has strict rules on profanity

[20:13:55]

bjd:

mind, i don't swear and it doesn't bother me =)

[20:13:56]

jduggan:

dustybin: why? =] im quite clear on the channel policy :)

[20:14:35]

iamlindoro:

dustybin, a) before I was a channel admin or myth dev, b) before the channel admins agreed to more strictly enforce channel courtesy and profanity policies

[20:14:50]

iamlindoro:

dustybin, But way to put yourself on my list

[20:14:53]

dustybin:

aye ok :D

[20:15:06]

dustybin:

im only joking :D

[20:15:24]

iamlindoro:

I don't care for your jokes. And generally speaking, nobody cares for your serious, either

[20:17:20]

kormoc:

Ahh, good old arguments with the /ignored

[20:17:39]

bjd:

heh

[20:19:31]

cecil:

hi kormoc, you up and disappeared on me at SCALE last weekend :-)

[20:20:13]

kormoc:

cecil: Heh, I told you I was at the FSF booth :)

[20:20:52]

cecil:

couldn't remember

[20:20:58]

kormoc:

No worries :)

[20:21:03]

cecil:

was a busy week beforehand

[20:21:09]

kormoc:

It was a pretty awesome conference and I plan to be back

[20:21:15]

cecil:

cool!

[20:21:18]

kormoc:

Especially with the partnership :)

[20:21:51]

cecil:

perhaps next year, we can have a shot of Patron together ;)

[20:21:58]

kormoc:

cecil: For sure!

[20:22:23]

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[20:22:37]

** cecil turns around to do some work work now... **

[20:23:01]

Aevum:

hello

[20:23:10]

** kormoc waves **

[20:23:18]

** Aevum particles **

[20:24:21]

Aevum:

anyways, bad physics jokes aside, i was looking over the install guides for several o/s's and im wondering

[20:24:40]

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[20:24:47]

Aevum:

is there a standart install i can just drop in to a clean Atom/Ion machine ?

[20:24:59]

Aevum:

like the XBMC Live that has a hard drive install option

[20:25:21]

wagnerrp:

Aevum: mythtv does not ship binaries that can be installed

[20:25:40]

wagnerrp:

however i know at least mythbuntu has an ISO that can be booted from

[20:25:42]

Aevum:

everything is to be compiled

[20:25:47]

kormoc:

LinHES might do the trick

[20:25:56]

wagnerrp:

with the official packages, yes.... you only get source

[20:26:21]

Aevum:

ok

[20:26:24]

jarle:

is it possible to disable an input card for a while? So that mythtv will not use it?

[20:26:47]

iamlindoro:

The easiest way is to disassociate the lineup with the input

[20:27:20]

Aevum:

XBMC works ok

[20:27:52]

Aevum:

i guess i have to work harder on emulator integration

[20:27:56]

jarle:

iamlindoro: my card is not working, however myth wants to use this card if I enter live TV..

[20:28:04]

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[20:28:25]

iamlindoro:

so do the above

[20:28:54]

iamlindoro:

in mythtv-setup, detach the video source from the input/card

[20:29:03]

jarle:

iamlindoro: oki...

[20:32:19]

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[20:37:37]

cecil:

kormoc: thanks for the pointer, pity he didn't stay around long enough

[20:37:47]

cecil:

as we have several emulators in our repo

[20:38:09]

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[20:38:17]

kormoc:

Np :)

[20:39:42]

jarle:

iamlindoro: seemed to work fine...

[20:41:32]

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[20:44:12]

dashcloud:

hi, if I'm looking for a cheap way to add an SD-only frontend to my myth setup, is there an Ion-style setup with analog connectors, or do I need to look at one of the various media streamers out there?

[20:44:55]

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[20:45:21]

wagnerrp:

AFAIK, there are no VDPAU capable boards with svideo output

[20:45:31]

wagnerrp:

discrete graphics only

[20:45:36]

wagnerrp:

either that, or you need a scan converter

[20:45:41]

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[20:51:26]

dashcloud:

wagnerrp: so is it worth building (or buying) a new frontend, or just get a media streamer box until the TV gets upgraded to HD?

[20:51:53]

cecil:

dashcloud: if I were in your shoes, I'd build one

[20:52:15]

cecil:

IMHO, a "media streamer" doesn't compare to a real mythfrontend

[20:53:24]

cecil:

drop an nvidia 8400 chipset based card w/ svideo out

[20:53:31]

cecil:

SD today and ready for HD tomorrow

[20:53:38]

cecil:

and that is that

[20:53:49]

wagnerrp:

right, and if you want a small system, you can get a case that supports riser cards

[20:54:04]

wagnerrp:

or, you can just use your ION with a $40-$50 scan converter

[20:54:38]

dashcloud:

can you get me a link to a scan converter? I think I know what they are, but not totally sure

[20:55:06]

wagnerrp:

newegg has a couple

[20:55:10]

wagnerrp:

google will find you more

[20:55:22]

wagnerrp:

theyll work, but dont expect great quality video out of them

[20:59:31]

wagnerrp:

sphery: im not a lawyer, so believe me when i say im not doing anything illegal

[21:00:29]

sphery:

wagnerrp: I can't believe his, "I'm not a lawyer either, but I will be in August. ;-)"

[21:00:47]

kormoc:

sphery: Ooh! That's a gem!

[21:00:52]

kormoc:

what thread is that?

[21:01:04]

sphery:

Not to mention the whole, "If you don't agree to the EULA, you can steal TMS's copyrighted data from Microsoft."

[21:01:20]

sphery:

kormoc: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/425044#425044

[21:01:35]

sphery:

kormoc: my response: http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-users/2010 . . . /282584.html

[21:02:10]

sphery:

kormoc: having a person knowledgeable about TMS's copyrights on listings data (descriptions, possibly more?) post that there is copyrighted data would be nice

[21:02:31]

dashcloud:

thanks guys!

[21:03:25]

kormoc:

sphery: xris would be the better one, he knows all the legal stuff we can and can't disclose

[21:03:32]

sphery:

If the guy really is in law school and about to pass the bar, you'd think he'd know not to give legal advice on the mailing list

[21:03:37]

kormoc:

Yeah...

[21:03:45]

sphery:

kormoc: ok

[21:04:26]

sphery:

just wanted someone to dispute his claim that there's no copyrighted (even copyrightable) information in the listings

[21:04:54]

kormoc:

Aye

[21:05:05]

kormoc:

if xris doesn't feel like it, I'll put a word in

[21:05:13]

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[21:06:43]

sphery:

wagnerrp: also, since when is there a rule that if you don't want people accessing your data, you have to use good technological protection measures? He's saying that the ToS of every single website is invalid if there's no authentication/authorization component.

[21:07:40]

kormoc:

there is no such rule, as the terms of service cover the service of giving you that information, if you don't agree to the terms, then you have no right to the service (funny how the name defines it!)

[21:07:50]

xris:

technically, I think it's all copyrighted

[21:08:17]

xris:

TMS even claims ownership of the data for the program and episode names, though I don't think that would hold up very well

[21:08:59]

sphery:

xris: would be nice if you could reply to say that there is copyright – http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/425065#425065 "But the data is not copyrighted (at least not by Microsoft or Zap2It)"

[21:09:00]

xris:

but TMS definitely has a legit copyright on things like descriptions. they employ a huge staff of people to write those

[21:09:31]

xris:

sphery: you'll have to remind me of that later when I'm not headed out the door to go home

[21:09:59]

sphery:

TTBOMK, it's also possible to copyright a collection of facts as a work--where the act of collecting those facts is, itself, not a simple task

[21:10:11]

sphery:

and, TV listings data would definitely fall under that description

[21:10:22]

sphery:

xris: cool, thanks

[21:15:21]

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[21:18:08]

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[21:19:51]

xris:

sphery: ok, replied.

[21:19:54]

xris:

mc2xml bugs me.

[21:20:55]

** xris goes home **

[21:22:40]

wagnerrp:

here we go... Christopher Meredith, Mississippi College School of Law

[21:22:42]

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[21:24:42]

sphery:

xris: thanks

[21:25:30]

sphery:

xris: excellent reply

[21:25:44]

wagnerrp:

chris fight!

[21:25:54]

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[21:26:00]

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[21:31:46]

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[21:32:26]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp, wonder what his professors/the dean of his college would think of his esteemed legal opinion

[21:32:42]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: I think you should ask them!

[21:32:45]

iamlindoro:

and of someone just about to take the bar enjoining others to break copyright

[21:32:49]

iamlindoro:

No joke

[21:33:23]

iamlindoro:

And as ever, the core argument is, you didn't pay for it, it's WRONG TO TAKE IT

[21:34:01]

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[21:34:47]

mchou:

wow

[21:34:59]

kormoc:

indeed

[21:35:44]

kormoc:

should ask if the college is okay with a pre-bar law student giving legal advice publicly as well...

[21:35:49]

mchou:

do I have to "pay" to get a list of names and dates of all US presidents terms in office?

[21:36:07]

sphery:

mchou: don't argue it, you know you're wrong

[21:36:14]

mchou:

baloney

[21:36:30]

mchou:

at best the descriptions are copyrigted

[21:36:30]

sphery:

mchou: there's a big difference between a compilation of easy-to-obtain facts and a compilation of hard-to-obtain facts

[21:36:39]

sphery:

mchou: /and/ there are non-factual data in there

[21:37:08]

** sphery is happy to have remembered the word is "compilation" in copyright, so now he can look up info **

[21:37:10]

iamlindoro:

and I consider any argument to the contrary to run afoul of our channel rules banning copyright infringement

[21:37:14]

mchou:

the date, times, programs names, specifically is not copyrighted (although a compilation is)

[21:37:35]

mchou:

and that's the point

[21:38:05]

kormoc:

seconded on the afoul point

[21:38:05]

sphery:

mchou: the point is that it costs TMS a fortune to obtain that data

[21:38:23]

sphery:

mchou: if you think it's so easy to get your "list of presidents" for TV listings, just do it yourself and don't steal TMS's data

[21:38:38]

iamlindoro:

which makes the downloading of the compilation without permission and in violation of MS'/TMS' ToS copyright infrigement

[21:38:42]

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[21:39:05]

mchou:

sphery: the data might cost a fortune fortune to compile

[21:39:13]

kormoc:

not even considering that TMS licenses the data from the networks creating the content, and thus having a chain of custody on the copyrights

[21:39:21]

mchou:

but facts are by definition not copyrightable

[21:39:23]

pete27:

Hi, I just returned to MythTV after a year hiatus, and am REALLY impressed with the progress. MythTV is pretty awesome now.

[21:39:32]

sphery:

A "compilation" is a work formed by the collection and assembling of preexisting materials or of data that are selected, coordinated, or arranged in such a way that the resulting work as a whole constitutes an original work of authorship.

[21:39:36]

sphery:

http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#103

[21:39:50]

kormoc:

pete27: thanks, glad to have you back :)

[21:40:21]

pete27:

The new Terra theme is great in many ways, but the weird font colors (black is selected, white is inactive?) and poor visibility of MythVideo media library items made Terra unusable.

[21:40:30]

pete27:

So I edited the there to change around some things

[21:40:54]

pete27:

Should I contribute this back, or is this stuff already being done?

[21:41:37]

sphery:

[21:41:42]

sphery:

IANAL

[21:41:46]

kormoc:

pete27: best is to talk with the theme author (gbee for terra iirc) and see, but in a large bit, themes are really artistic in nature and thus they might disagree

[21:41:46]

iamlindoro:

pete27, the author of the theme has noted on a few occasions that he is satisfied with the contrast/color choices on his display, so I think it's fair to say that it's a sensitive point with him and that he's probably not interested in changing it

[21:41:53]

sphery:

and, unlike many in today's society, IANAT

[21:41:57]

kormoc:

there ya go

[21:42:22]

mchou:

sphery: [17:35:49] <mchou> do I have to "pay" to get a list of names and dates of all US presidents terms in office?

[21:42:48]

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[21:42:49]

mchou:

sphery: stop dodging the question

[21:43:03]

wagnerrp:

if you want to get it in printed book form, the publisher has every right to charge

[21:43:03]

sphery:

mchou: easily obtained factual data, not a compilation such that the mere colleciton of the data adds value

[21:43:04]

iamlindoro:

mchou, Again, I consider your argument that downloading listings in violation of terms of use and violation of TMS copyright an infringement of channel rules

[21:43:06]

pete27:

I hear you guys, but come on, have yo usued this?

[21:43:12]

iamlindoro:

please drop it or you'll be leaving

[21:43:14]

mchou:

sphery: since iamlindoro equated that to "stealing"

[21:43:14]

sphery:

mchou: so, no, you don't have to pay for a list of US presidents

[21:43:38]

sphery:

mchou: you /do/ have to pay for any copyrighted work (or at least obtain sufficient license to use said work)

[21:43:39]

iamlindoro:

pete27, Yes-- speaking only for myself, the contrast is fine on my displays

[21:44:07]

sphery:

mchou: in other words, your example is not similar enough to disprove his point

[21:44:33]

pete27:

Oh well, i'm using a 1080p projector, so I guess my contrast isn't as good as most people's. But black text for selected and white for inactive!!! Its maddening.

[21:44:48]

mchou:

sphery: so aside from program descriptions, and base on my example of US presidents, times of dates of when a particular show airs, do I have to "pay" for it?

[21:45:05]

pete27:

Anyway, I'm just worried I'll forget i changed it and install an update and then be angry i didn't save the theme or contribute it to the community

[21:45:10]

iamlindoro:

mchou, last warning

[21:45:12]

iamlindoro:

conversation over

[21:45:28]

sphery:

mchou: there is value added by the mere compilation of those hard-to-obtain facts

[21:45:33]

sphery:

so, yes, it is copyrightable

[21:45:48]

wagnerrp:

if you want free, be happy with your marginal EIT data

[21:45:55]

mchou:

iamlindoro: if you cant deal with the facts, just end the discussion

[21:46:11]

iamlindoro:

I am ending it. Continue it and face consequences. Can't say I haven't warned you adequately.

[21:46:18]

mchou:

wagnerrp: oh, that brings up another point

[21:46:24]

sphery:

mchou: you can freely discuss when a particular program airs or its title or subtitle--as those are facts--but the compilation of all of the info that makes up your listings data is copyrightable--even if it is mostly factual data

[21:46:30]

mchou:

do I have to pay for "eit" data?

[21:46:44]

wagnerrp:

no, because the owner of the data is freely broadcasting it

[21:46:49]

sphery:

mchou: you're licensed to use it under the same license you receive your broadcast

[21:46:52]

mchou:

either directly or by taxation?

[21:46:53]

sphery:

it = EIT

[21:47:25]

mchou:

sphery: lol

[21:47:44]

mchou:

it's the broadcasters who are subjects to licences

[21:47:49]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +o iamlindoro

[21:47:55]

Mode for #mythtv-users by iamlindoro!~iamlindor@unaffiliated/iamlindoro : +q mchou!*@*

[21:47:58]

iamlindoro:

enough

[21:48:03]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : -o iamlindoro

[21:48:31]

iamlindoro:

sick of the bad behavior, and I've given enough warnings over enough days/weeks/months

[21:49:01]

sphery:

agreed

[21:49:19]

sphery:

he had plenty of warning

[21:56:36]

Brad-D:

that was like watching a train wreck

[21:56:39]

Brad-D:

in slow motion

[21:56:40]

swerve:

after upgrade to 0.22 lost some key functions

[21:56:41]

Brad-D:

haha

[21:57:21]

swerve:

rt arrow key in recordings screen used to bring up a menu – now it doesn't

[21:57:39]

wagnerrp:

swerve: its a side effect of the new UI engine

[21:57:52]

wagnerrp:

now that lists do not have to be vertical

[21:57:53]

swerve:

can i reset in the keybindings optoins?

[21:58:03]

wagnerrp:

defining such a function to the right arrow key would be limiting

[21:58:16]

swerve:

wait... "i" key now seems to do it

[21:58:19]

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[21:58:29]

swerve:

okay – I thought the function was totally gone

[21:58:39]

swerve:

wagnerrp: limiting? how so

[21:58:56]

wagnerrp:

if you have a horizontal list

[21:59:12]

wagnerrp:

having an action bound to the right arrow would mean you could not scroll through it

[21:59:12]

swerve:

but what if you don't? :P

[21:59:36]

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[22:00:24]

swerve:

also – any way to reorder the options on main page?

[22:00:34]

swerve:

main screen*

[22:00:52]

wagnerrp:

yes, there are multiple 'menu themes' available for selection in the settings

[22:00:55]

wagnerrp:

or you can edit your own

[22:02:02]

swerve:

i don't see any edit options anywhere – can only change to premade menu schemes

[22:02:28]

wagnerrp:

you have to exit the menu xml directly if you want to change it beyond the defaults

[22:02:47]

swerve:

where does that file live?

[22:03:05]

wagnerrp:

somewhere in the mythtv shared folder

[22:03:09]

swerve:

linux machine btw

[22:03:20]

swerve:

home folder?

[22:03:28]

wagnerrp:

shared folder

[22:03:40]

wagnerrp:

{PREFIX}/share/mythtv

[22:07:00]

swerve:

thx wagnerrp, found it

[22:08:05]

swerve:

mythtv just gets more unbelievably awesome all the time

[22:08:23]

swerve:

i can't believe how many configuration options there are for just about *everything*

[22:09:34]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:09:51]

Beirdo:

the problem with that is it gets more and more complex too :)

[22:09:56]

Beirdo:

but more options is cooool

[22:10:44]

swerve:

i sometimes wish there weren't so many nested menus – gets hard to remember where settings are

[22:14:48]

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[22:15:29]

swerve:

but otherwise – wow

[22:18:03]

Beirdo:

yeah, that is a disadvantage to having SO many options to be sure

[22:18:22]

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[22:18:30]

wagnerrp:

for better or worse, theres been a push to drop as many options as possible

[22:18:59]

Beirdo:

well, I hope we don't lose useful functionality in the process

[22:19:07]

wagnerrp:

well that would be the worse

[22:19:12]

Beirdo:

only useless functionality :)

[22:19:32]

wagnerrp:

well, useful as deemed by the devs at the time

[22:19:44]

Beirdo:

it's a fine line between configurability and maintainability

[22:19:45]

wagnerrp:

which causes consternation among the less contributing users

[22:20:12]

Beirdo:

well, that is understandable, but not "smart" in some ways...

[22:20:26]

Beirdo:

but yeah, if nobody steps up to take care of a feature...

[22:20:48]

Beirdo:

and devs aren't being PAID to maintain it...

[22:21:08]

Beirdo:

so yeah

[22:21:53]

Beirdo:

is there a list of "disappearing" features so people can step up and take ownership?

[22:22:06]

swerve:

not a programmer, but some functions seem maybe redundant

[22:22:17]

andreax:

After testing latest svn (from a couple of hours ago) i lost all entries in the playback groups (like video renderer, osd-renderer and deinterlacer). I got that just on my remote frontend since some days now and cant find a reason why. Any ideas?

[22:22:38]

wagnerrp:

there was a ML thread a couple months ago about removal of options

[22:22:40]

wagnerrp:

trying to find it

[22:22:52]

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[22:22:52]

Beirdo:

K. Should we make a wiki page?

[22:23:31]

Beirdo:

call the page ChoppingBlock :)

[22:23:31]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:23:35]

wagnerrp:

i believe there was a wiki page made to go along with it

[22:23:44]

Beirdo:

cool

[22:24:34]

Beirdo:

dangit.

[22:24:39]

Beirdo:

kormoc's off.

[22:24:57]

Beirdo:

wanted to ask him something about the perl binding bugs.

[22:25:50]

wagnerrp:

here we go... http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/405622

[22:26:02]

sphery:

Beirdo: I think the main problem with the settings is testing changes. You fix one bug, but test it with one configuration and find out later that you just broke something else when some random setting you've never heard of is enabled

[22:26:16]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: the perl bindings are somewhat in search of a maintainer

[22:26:38]

sphery:

it's not so much that it takes effort to maintain the settings or the if statement that uses the value--just that when you have 12 different configurations possible, testing changes with all 12 is a /lot/ of work

[22:27:16]

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[22:27:22]

wagnerrp:

luckily the possible configurations of the python stuff is rather limited

[22:27:35]

wagnerrp:

i get it working with RDV's stuff, and theres 98% of the user base right there

[22:29:15]

wagnerrp:

heres another one! http://mythtv.org/wiki/SoC2006#Settings_Rework.2FEnhancements

[22:29:45]

sphery:

heh, yeah, poor guy never had a chance

[22:29:57]

sphery:

the lists killed his project

[22:30:19]

sphery:

after all, people who had no idea what settings did were making decisions about how useful they were

[22:30:53]

wagnerrp:

man... did any of that stuff succeed?

[22:31:03]

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[22:31:05]

Beirdo:

sorry, I was reading backlog

[22:31:18]

wagnerrp:

mythexport is the name of something shipped with mythbuntu, but i dont know if thats related

[22:31:19]

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[22:31:38]

wagnerrp:

the windows port now finally works halfway decently within the last several months

[22:31:39]

Beirdo:

wagnerrp: for the perl bindings, I think between myself and kormoc and xris (assuming they are willing) we can get it maintained

[22:32:01]

sphery:

Beirdo: it would be /really/ nice to get it up to snuff with the Python bindings

[22:32:08]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: well sphery has actually been looking for someone to get it rewritten

[22:32:12]

Beirdo:

sphery: very good point.

[22:32:12]

wagnerrp:

rather than just maintained

[22:32:13]

sphery:

(i.e. make it higher level hooks)

[22:32:22]

sphery:

right now it's all very low-level stuff

[22:32:58]

Beirdo:

well, I'll talk to them :)

[22:33:09]

Beirdo:

nuvexport (IMHO) should use the perl bindings

[22:33:26]

Beirdo:

which will take some rework

[22:33:30]

sphery:

right

[22:34:05]

sphery:

it was made before the perl bindings--IIRC, the perl bindings came about when xr is took a bunch of the code from them and put it in a reusable lib

[22:34:15]

Beirdo:

WAY before the bindings

[22:34:16]

sphery:

s/them/nuvexport/

[22:34:16]

Beirdo:

heh

[22:34:39]

Beirdo:

and yes, the bindings seem to be based on nuvexport internals that I remember from 4 years back

[22:34:55]

Beirdo:

fun times

[22:35:01]

wagnerrp:

that does explain why it has code to pull video properties from midentify

[22:35:07]

wagnerrp:

i never did understand why that was in there

[22:35:16]

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[22:35:33]

Beirdo:

because it was necessary in nuvexport from antiquity

[22:35:43]

Beirdo:

is that possible to pull from the backend?

[22:36:16]

wagnerrp:

not at current

[22:36:20]

Beirdo:

although, I *personally* like that nuvexport will run without the backend... but I can be convinced otherwise

[22:36:23]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:36:23]

wagnerrp:

you can pull some information from the database tables

[22:36:48]

wagnerrp:

but there is no ability to run arbitrary commands on the backend

[22:36:50]

Beirdo:

well, if we can work on getting all the required metadata available, we could sure clean that up a lot

[22:36:52]

wagnerrp:

(for the better)

[22:37:16]

Beirdo:

obviously NOT for the upcoming release :)

[22:37:18]

Beirdo:

heh

[22:37:23]

Beirdo:

but future

[22:39:47]

Beirdo:

hmmm.

[22:40:02]

Beirdo:

display live preview of recordings... there SHOULD be an override on that

[22:40:05]

Beirdo:

IMHO

[22:40:16]

Beirdo:

i.e. permanent disable.

[22:40:30]

wagnerrp:

sphery: i wonder if the use of quotes around 'owns' on the mailing list means hes running a pirated version of windows MCE

[22:40:39]

Beirdo:

that can be a compile option rather than online configuration though

[22:41:08]

sphery:

wagnerrp: good question

[22:41:13]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: that capability doesnt even exist to make it an option

[22:41:27]

sphery:

wagnerrp: but, from my reading, if he doesn't agree to the EULA for MS MCE, he can steal it legally

[22:41:33]

Beirdo:

oh? It used to

[22:41:49]

wagnerrp:

mythtv does not currently support the live preview of recordings

[22:41:53]

Beirdo:

oh

[22:41:54]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:41:57]

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[22:42:03]

Beirdo:

so it's already permanently disabled :)

[22:42:04]

wagnerrp:

its a 'widget' not yet written for the new interface code

[22:42:04]

Beirdo:

heh

[22:42:31]

Beirdo:

when it comes back, it would be good to allow people to disable it if they are low on CPU

[22:42:42]

Beirdo:

compile-time works though :)

[22:42:54]

wagnerrp:

if theyre on a low CPU, they can use a lightweight theme that doesnt do live preview

[22:43:01]

Beirdo:

true

[22:43:14]

wagnerrp:

or they can edit a theme to their own desires

[22:43:14]

Beirdo:

but let's make sure we have some. :)

[22:43:35]

wagnerrp:

there are currently some themes that use fanart, and others that dont

[22:43:50]

Beirdo:

I'm kinda opposed to assuming everyone has mondo CPU :)

[22:44:08]

Beirdo:

some will, some won't

[22:44:18]

wagnerrp:

i dont see what the problem with live preview is anyway

[22:44:21]

Beirdo:

and with little settop boxes...

[22:44:30]

wagnerrp:

if you have the power to play it, you have the power to preview it

[22:44:40]

wagnerrp:

and if you dont have the power to play it, time to toss that box in the garbage

[22:44:48]

Beirdo:

it used to seriously lag my box

[22:44:59]

Beirdo:

that's not the right answer :)

[22:45:07]

Beirdo:

not everyone has limitless money :)

[22:45:17]

wagnerrp:

why record something if you cant play it?

[22:45:27]

Beirdo:

true

[22:45:35]

Beirdo:

to convert it?

[22:45:36]

Beirdo:

:)

[22:45:47]

Beirdo:

but yeah, that's not the primary purpose of myth for sure

[22:46:04]

wagnerrp:

then its converted, and the video is now of some format you have the power to preview

[22:46:12]

Beirdo:

with GPU acceleration available, it's likely not to be an issue anyways

[22:46:39]

Beirdo:

never mind :)

[22:47:28]

wagnerrp:

basically, if you want to have frontends incapable of playing some of your content

[22:47:32]

wagnerrp:

set up recording groups

[22:47:37]

wagnerrp:

and filter with such

[22:47:58]

Beirdo:

yup

[22:48:07]

Beirdo:

I am being convinced :)

[22:48:39]

wagnerrp:

or perhaps have the backend do some cursory benchmark on the video during recording, or maybe during commflag

[22:48:59]

wagnerrp:

and have a 'performance' value tabulated for the recording

[22:49:16]

wagnerrp:

if that frontend doesnt match the performance requirement, dont display it

[22:49:19]

fryfrog:

would bitrate not be a good value ?

[22:49:24]

fryfrog:

to look at?

[22:49:39]

Beirdo:

wagnerrp: that would be nice

[22:49:45]

wagnerrp:

it would have to be a combination of bitrate, codec, and a slew of other encoding options

[22:49:53]

fryfrog:

ah, that is true

[22:50:00]

wagnerrp:

for instance, theres a huge difference between CABAC and CAVLC in h264

[22:50:32]

Beirdo:

"this video requires X bogomips".. or something like that

[22:50:33]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:50:52]

Beirdo:

and yes, I know bogomips ain't the real thing to use

[22:50:58]

wagnerrp:

instructions per fortnight

[22:51:04]

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[22:51:07]

Beirdo:

yeah

[22:51:20]

wagnerrp:

bigger numbers, make people feel better about their marginal hardware

[22:51:27]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:51:44]

Beirdo:

trillion instructions per fortnight?

[22:51:51]

fryfrog:

should use the same scale that win7 uses

[22:51:56]

fryfrog:

where you can't get a 7 or what ever it is

[22:51:58]

fryfrog:

just 6.9

[22:52:01]

wagnerrp:

no, thats a horrible scale

[22:52:05]

Beirdo:

what's that? rand() * 7

[22:52:08]

fryfrog:

i know, so horrible :p

[22:52:19]

wagnerrp:

what? you dont have a hard drive? 0.0

[22:52:20]

fryfrog:

it is like 1–8 or 1–7

[22:52:33]

fryfrog:

and ... yeah, such a funny rating :p

[22:53:41]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: although bogo wouldnt be a bad basis to try... where does that come from?

[22:53:48]

Beirdo:

anyways, we'll see when the feature is possibly available again.

[22:53:51]

wagnerrp:

is that cursory test the kernel does on boot?

[22:53:54]

Beirdo:

yep

[22:54:02]

fryfrog:

wagnerrp: and is in /proc/cpuinfo

[22:54:07]

wagnerrp:

i know

[22:54:09]

fryfrog:

ah

[22:54:28]

Beirdo:

there's code available to calculate it

[22:55:09]

Beirdo:

it's essentially a tight counting loop, or something like that

[22:56:41]

Beirdo:

but if somehow we can determine approximate bogomips requirements based on bitrate, codec parameters, etc... that could be useful

[22:56:41]

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[22:57:10]

Beirdo:

'computational complexity'

[22:57:35]

Beirdo:

there, have some big words to make it sound cooler than it is

[22:58:23]

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[23:00:13]

wagnerrp:

Beirdo: better to just have the commflagger measure what is needed directly

[23:00:27]

wagnerrp:

since those values are going to change from ffmpeg sync to sync

[23:00:37]

Beirdo:

true

[23:01:53]

wagnerrp:

oh look, the would-be lawyer is now claiming there are no consequences about violating what is effectively a contract

[23:02:01]

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[23:02:02]

Beirdo:

heh

[23:02:16]

Beirdo:

I really need to resubscribe.

[23:02:36]

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[23:02:37]

Beirdo:

I need my daily aggravation and entertainment at others' expense

[23:04:09]

Beirdo:

done :)

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[23:27:04]

sphery:

wagnerrp: yeah, I have no idea what he means by, "I'm not a party to it so what does it matter?

[23:27:51]

sphery:

I guess he's saying that because he didn't agree to the EULA for MCE, he's not obliged to abide by the ToS for the EPG.

[23:28:16]

sphery:

which is completely lacking in anything resembling logic, IMHO

[23:28:21]

sphery:

as the EPG is part of MCE

[23:28:33]

sphery:

so if he's using the EPG, he must do so under its EULA

[23:29:39]

cecil:

such crap logic

[23:30:00]

janneg:

yes, ffmpeg's h264 decoder got already over 20% faster this year

[23:30:11]

kormoc:

I sorta think the thread needs to die no matter what

[23:30:30]

sphery:

yeah, I'm done with it

[23:30:34]

cecil:

he (and others) obviously have no idea of MythTV's past in reguard to programming data nor do they appreciate the hard work that went into creating Schedules Direct

[23:30:40]

sphery:

probably should have stopped earlier

[23:32:01]

kormoc:

well, it should be stated that as a official myth mailing list, we don't condone ToS Violations in any form and thus talk about the issue is not allowed

[23:34:10]

Beirdo:

janneg: In the future (not for this release?) I'd like to chat with you about adding a few more checks to ./configure

[23:34:28]

Beirdo:

I seem to remember it's partially your baby?

[23:34:37]

Beirdo:

or am I on crack :)

[23:34:55]

kormoc:

they're not exclusive :P

[23:34:55]

high-rez:

I thouht he leased the configure script from RMS.

[23:35:06]

high-rez:

s/thouht/thought

[23:35:14]

Beirdo:

kormoc: true daty

[23:35:17]

Beirdo:

dat

[23:35:20]

Beirdo:

stupid fingers

[23:36:28]

sphery:

Beirdo: you're not on crack (at least, he is the one to ask about configure)

[23:39:37]

janneg:

Beirdo: well it's mostly the ffmpeg configure script

[23:41:50]

high-rez:

Is it possible to specify a different location for generated thumbnails then the files they were generated from? E.g. if you have a really large FS allocsize for your recordings, thumbnails can start to be a problem.

[23:42:11]

wagnerrp:

high-rez: no they cant

[23:42:32]

wagnerrp:

or do you mean the special XFS pre-allocate stuff?

[23:42:41]

wagnerrp:

(i thought you were talking about block size)

[23:42:51]

high-rez:

Right, xfs pre-allocate stuff

[23:43:11]

high-rez:

e.g. mounted with allocsize=128m

[23:43:20]

high-rez:

A small jpeg thumbnail will eat 128megs.

[23:43:29]

high-rez:

As I understand it.

[23:43:33]

wagnerrp:

not quite

[23:43:53]

wagnerrp:

it just means that as long as that file is open, no other file will touch the 128MB behind it

[23:43:56]

high-rez:

Will it just try to allocate 128m continuous – but if its not all used allow other stuff to fill it in ?

[23:44:06]

high-rez:

I see.

[23:44:18]

wagnerrp:

correct, after you close the file, you can do whatever you want with the remaining space

[23:44:21]

high-rez:

Ok, so its not quite the problem I thought it was.

[23:44:29]

wagnerrp:

i thought you were talking about block size

[23:44:38]

wagnerrp:

where the file actually will consume that much space

[23:44:48]

high-rez:

Nah, just trying to get as much out of my filesystem as I can.

[23:45:15]

high-rez:

I'm recording a ton a day.

[23:47:31]

wagnerrp:

that pre-allocate stuff is only useful if you record multiple things simultaneously to a single disk

[23:47:41]

high-rez:

I do.

[23:48:04]

high-rez:

:)

[23:48:57]

high-rez:

Just having 'a few' favorite shows and multiple tuners can lead to massive recording simultaneous recording action.

[23:49:00]

kormoc:

wow

[23:49:28]

kormoc:

whoever did the wiki thing for "Optimizing XFS on RAID Arrays" missed a very important part that everyone seems to miss

[23:49:37]

high-rez:

kormoc: What's that?

[23:49:51]

** high-rez probably missed it **

[23:49:56]

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[23:49:57]

high-rez:

If it wasn't on the wiki :)

[23:50:05]

kormoc:

setting your block size to the same as the chunk/stripe size only helps if your filesystem starts exactly on a stripe boundary

[23:50:22]

Beirdo:

janneg: sorry, I was off squashing a nuvexport bug...

[23:50:43]

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[23:51:05]

Beirdo:

OK, the issues are: it says it is missing qmake4... then you install qt4 (older than 4.4), and it complains you need qt4.4 or newer

[23:51:38]

Beirdo:

the qmake4 one should indicate it needs qt4.4 or greater so fools like me don't end up installing twice :)

[23:51:44]

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[23:52:07]

Beirdo:

the other is that libasound2-dev (ubuntu package naming) has a minimum version requirement

[23:52:11]

Beirdo:

and it's not being checked

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[23:53:28]

janneg:

wagnerrp: which fs has 128m blocksize? finding a linux fs with blocksize != 4k is hard

[23:54:04]

wagnerrp:

janneg: i thought he was talking about blocksize, not pre-allocation

[23:54:21]

wagnerrp:

in which case, mythtv would not be generating enough files for a large blocksize to be an issue

[23:55:04]

janneg:

Beirdo: feel free to add the min required qt version

[23:55:13]

bonelifer:

Wish I had known about the Antec Fusion Remote MAX. I would of got it. Man that a tight fit with the ASUS GT-220 right by the Haupauge PVR-500. I can't put the 500 i the other PCI slot because it keeps the ATX12V from getting to the powersupply.

[23:55:51]

janneg:

you have a svn account, right?

[23:55:55]

Beirdo:

janneg: OK. It's a text fix

[23:55:57]

Beirdo:

yes

[23:56:15]

Beirdo:

checking for the ALSA min version will be trickier

[23:56:39]

janneg:

ccheck for the required feature

[23:57:23]

Beirdo:

yeah. I'll look into it, but I didn't want to tread on toes :)

[23:57:31]

janneg:

I assume compilation fails because the header misses a function/define

[23:57:36]

Beirdo:

yup

[23:57:36]

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[23:58:29]

Beirdo:

most newish distros have new enough versions... but it is a requirement nonetheless

[23:58:38]

janneg:

if you pastebin the error I'll fix it tomorrow

[23:58:42]

Beirdo:

sure

[23:58:54]

Beirdo:

oh...hehe

[23:59:12]

Beirdo:

it is on my computer an hour from here... I'll dig it out though, one moment

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