Beirdobot, irc.freenode.net

Tuesday, March 9th, 2010, 00:00 AST

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Geminizer:

hello all. does anyone know which process is responsible for capturing video (during recording) ?

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wagnerrp:

mythbackend

[00:22:28]

wagnerrp:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Executive_Overview

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Geminizer:

wagnerrp: would you know if it is possible to communicate with mythbackend via the CLI ? (e.g. mythbackend -cancel_recording) ?

[00:24:29]

wagnerrp:

not exactly

[00:24:48]

wagnerrp:

there are a handful of events you can send from the command line

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wagnerrp:

issuing a scheduler, refreshing the settings cache, refreshing the upnp server, sending a custom event to the event system

[00:25:32]

wagnerrp:

canceling a recording is not one of them

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wagnerrp:

you would have to hit it directly over mythproto for that one

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wagnerrp:

either that or edit the recording schedule, and trigger a scheduler run

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Geminizer:

wagnerrp: what do you mean by "trigger a scheduler run" ?

[00:39:28]

wagnerrp:

i mean exactly what i said

[00:40:01]

wagnerrp:

either run 'mythbackend --resched'

[00:40:13]

wagnerrp:

or send the backend command that would otherwise do the same thing

[00:41:05]

wagnerrp:

if you just want to stop a recording, and you arent actually looking to do it from the command line, the easiest way to do that would probably be through mythweb

[00:41:19]

wagnerrp:

just open it up, go to the recordings page, and delete the recording

[00:41:38]

wagnerrp:

or you can open it up, and set a custom override

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iamlindoro:

http://www.program-glitch-esc.net/ Heh, awesome

[00:47:40]

Geminizer:

that works for me... thanks for the help, wagnerrp.. and my apologies for broadcasting my question to both myth channels

[00:48:27]

wagnerrp:

another trailer?

[00:48:36]

wagnerrp:

seems so

[00:52:15]

wagnerrp:

i have to admit, i thought the original tron was pretty lame

[00:52:19]

wagnerrp:

but im excited about this one

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kormoc:

Way hotter females

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iamlindoro:

chick on the couch is super hot

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kormoc:

^^++

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wagnerrp:

(thats the only one you see)

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kormoc:

wagnerrp: there's one in white

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iamlindoro:

http://www.imdb.com/media/rm1739426048/nm1312575

[00:56:39]

iamlindoro:

http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3437729024/nm2100657

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iamlindoro:

First is chick on couch, I believe

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wagnerrp:

damnedable flash player, wont let me restart

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iamlindoro:

drag the play head

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wagnerrp:

i can drag the location wherever i want, the play button ceases to function once you hit the end

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wagnerrp:

no matter, im just pulling the file directly

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iamlindoro:

http://www.filmedge.net/Tron/images/SamQuorra_1800.jpg

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iamlindoro:

I loved original tron

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iamlindoro:

watched it a million times as a kid

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wagnerrp:

thats the thing

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wagnerrp:

i saw it as a kid and thought it was cool

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wagnerrp:

i saw it again... and was less impressed

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iamlindoro:

Have watched it as an adult multiple times, I still like :)

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wagnerrp:

wait... a... minute...

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wagnerrp:

this is a simulation running inside a computer

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wagnerrp:

a computer that has only been up for nine and a half days?

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iamlindoro:

where did 9.5 days come from?

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wagnerrp:

one with 2.5GB of memory, and runs Xorg

[01:09:35]

wagnerrp:

theyre running 'top' in the background of the terminal he wipes the dust off of

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iamlindoro:

While I am loathe to indulge nerdy overanalysis...

[01:10:29]

iamlindoro:

who says the simulation is running on that system?

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wagnerrp:

i guess thats the thing that booted up, and paged the other guy

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wagnerrp:

yeah, girl on the couch is wilde, shes got pretty distinct eyes

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iamlindoro:

I sure hope she's Wilde

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iamlindoro:

;)

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wagnerrp:

she is wearing black leather...

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iamlindoro:

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/9 . . . n_legacy.jpg

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iamlindoro:

nom nom

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wagnerrp:

glowing... black leather...

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kormoc:

I for one am a fan

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wagnerrp:

the woman in white is http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0261633/

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wagnerrp:

no, you were right first

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wagnerrp:

black hair threw me off, but i guess thats not hard at all to change

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achew22:

Is there a way to make a script be run when the sleep timer goes off instead of just DPMS'ing off

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wagnerrp:

IIRC, the sleep timer only exists to exit playback

[01:37:13]

wagnerrp:

and thats really only to prevent you from running livetv for extended periods

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mzb:

if I have the same number of digital tuners as there are available transports is there any sense in staggering the order of virtual tuners?

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mzb:

ie: t1=v1+v2, t2=v3+v4, t3=v5+v6 ... then add again: t1+=v7+v8, t2+=v9+v10, t3+=v11+v12

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Captain_Murdoch:

achew22, you could submit a patch to add a 'SLEEPTIMER_EXPIRED' system event. :)

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mzb:

(using 3 tuners set to 2 virtuals, and then increasing each to 4)

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jst_:

Is there a way to list upcoming recordings from the command line?

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[R]:

there is this command line program that connects to the backend

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[R]:

i froget the name t hogh

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wagnerrp:

'mythbackend --printsched'

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[R]:

wagnerrp: that is totally awesome

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jst_:

Great, thanks!

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wagnerrp:

sorta... wait until you see what it actually prints out

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wagnerrp:

it prints _everything_ duplicate, ignored, or otherwise

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achew22:

Captain_Murdoch: I might do that. Do you know where the system event code is?

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wagnerrp:

one would hope so

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jst_:

Yeah, that'll work though. Going away for a few weeks and I figured I'd watch TV if I have time.

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wagnerrp:

either that or hes got a short memory

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Captain_Murdoch:

achew22, add 1 line at the bottom of libs/libmythtv/mythsystemevent.cpp for where you add the new event name and it's description to make it appear in the editor, and then in the player code where the sleep timer expires, you just put SendMythSystemEvent("SLEEPTIMER_EXPIRED"); include mythsystemevent.h at the top of the player cpp file.

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achew22:

Captain_Murdoch: Wow, thanks! I do have a few questions though, which editor would it appear in?

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Captain_Murdoch:

the system event editor. :) in mythtv-setup and mythfrontend's setup page. all this assumes you're runnin trunk though, I should have mentioned that.

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Captain_Murdoch:

if you're not on trunk you'll have to wait till 0.23.

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wagnerrp:

trunk from any point after [23012]

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Captain_Murdoch:

yeah, was just looking up the changeset. :)

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justinh:

whee got my waterproof box made for the ethernet over power wireless bridge thingy :)

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wagnerrp:

ethernet over wireless power huh?

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justinh:

had to use velcro pads to mount everything though.. some idiot picked components that don't have mounting points

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wagnerrp:

an access point using PoE? or an access point using powerline networking?

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justinh:

the latter

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justinh:

supposed to be for buses with cctv so they can offload recorded data when the bus returns to the depot every night

[03:23:52]

wilberfan:

hmm. does the internal player support subtitle display? I've tried pressing 't', but no love...

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justinh:

course it does. for supported formats

[03:24:13]

wilberfan:

copied .srt file to same directory and changed name...

[03:24:19]

wagnerrp:

justinh: meaning theyll be in a big garage that would have no problem otherwise running cat6?

[03:24:30]

justinh:

video.avi for example needs a srt called video.srt

[03:24:42]

justinh:

wagnerrp: yup

[03:25:07]

wagnerrp:

so why bother with powerline?

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justinh:

they might get lucky & it'll all just work :)

[03:25:29]

justinh:

wagnerrp: I dunno, it's just some manager's splendid idea

[03:25:56]

justinh:

they don't pay me to come up with a solution I just assemble stuff :D

[03:26:17]

wilberfan:

right.. but all i get is a "no captions" when I press 't'...

[03:26:18]

wagnerrp:

we already have all these power conduits run, lets not waste $15 on copper, when we can blow an extra $500 on hardware!

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[03:27:02]

justinh:

there's another problem too. the boxes which came in have transparent lids. not what I ordered

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wagnerrp:

i cant even imagine the uplink time when youve got a bunch of clients all trying to push the days video backlog through

[03:28:00]

wagnerrp:

of course youll probably saturate wireless long before the powerline stuff

[03:28:09]

justinh:

probably

[03:28:25]

justinh:

hey stop letting practicalities get in the way of a really cool idea! ;-)

[03:28:48]

justinh:

that's the kind of talk which can get you negative attention from those PHBs

[03:28:58]

wagnerrp:

cool idea, but way overcomplicated

[03:29:30]

justinh:

wagnerrp: plus it's prolly cheaper than getting the buses modified to have a robust ethernet socket fitted

[03:30:11]

justinh:

apparently bus drivers have enough to worry about anyway without having to remember plugging the bus into the network every night ;)

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wagnerrp:

you would think someone would die from carbon monoxide when some oaf forgot to turn his engine off at night

[03:31:00]

justinh:

I do wish these perennial downloaders would get some clue. everybody assumes that there's nothing wrong with their files

[03:31:38]

justinh:

heh buses might have a workaround for that already

[03:31:55]

wagnerrp:

running out of gas?

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wagnerrp:

should just set up an air raid klaxon that goes off if they start up the engine without dumping the data first

[03:33:07]

justinh:

course these recorders are as much about curtailing errant drivers as much as anything

[03:33:23]

justinh:

what with the onboard accelerometers & all :)

[03:33:34]

wagnerrp:

well dont tell them that!

[03:34:00]

kormoc:

upload them live to youtube!

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justinh:

kormoc: there's a 3G module can be fitted for uploading live video to the net :)

[03:34:39]

kormoc:

nice

[03:35:05]

justinh:

not youtube though. I think there might be a privacy concern or two with that

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wagnerrp:

im trying to find some video i came across of an internal cam capturing a crash caused by the driver rooting around on the floor for their lost cellphone

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justinh:

heh

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kormoc:

wagnerrp: http://www2.nbc13.com/vtm/news/local/article/ . . . xting/70382/ ?

[03:43:18]

wagnerrp:

that could be it... remember it had something to do with a cell phone

[03:43:20]

justinh:

OOF!

[03:43:43]

justinh:

and nobody posted comments? heheh

[03:45:17]

wagnerrp:

is this guy actually accelerating? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-INwXT02dUY

[03:45:53]

kormoc:

looks that way

[03:46:57]

justinh:

heh none of these look like our kit. vid quality is too good for one thing

[03:48:49]

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[03:51:42]

justinh:

apparently the cctv recorder on the bus which got blown up on 7/7 was one of our competitors'. There wasn't any usable footage until forensics pieced the HDD back together

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[03:56:45]

justinh:

heh here's some from one of ours: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyXYnGv6y1U&feature=related

[03:57:08]

justinh:

the ceo is driving btw

[03:57:32]

justinh:

oh no.. not in that one. must be in another crash video

[03:58:30]

kormoc:

nice quality

[03:58:31]

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[03:59:27]

justinh:

recorded on SSD iirc

[04:00:22]

wagnerrp:

justinh: think your company could have chosen a name a bit further from 'transvestite'?

[04:00:40]

justinh:

heh

[04:00:58]

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[04:01:00]

justinh:

so much has those goddamn 'Vu' letters too

[04:01:02]

wagnerrp:

man... i thought that stuff got filtered from youtube

[04:01:13]

justinh:

what.,. tranny videos?

[04:01:39]

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[04:03:03]

wagnerrp:

well this is somewhat unrelated, but so very amusing... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xu9GzD002rk

[04:03:12]

justinh:

if you mean crash videos.. maybe they leave the ones where nobody gets hurt alone ;)

[04:03:45]

justinh:

heheheh.. like whut? lol

[04:05:41]

justinh:

hmm. now I have to make a very short cat5 patch cable

[04:06:04]

wagnerrp:

ive got one about two inches, including connectors

[04:07:24]

wagnerrp:

i really wish i had some video of a crash that happened about half a mile from my house

[04:08:25]

wagnerrp:

the only way i can imagine it happening is someone taking the corner too wide, ramping up one yard, completely clearing the next, and going nose first into the side of a van

[04:08:34]

wagnerrp:

it really must have been pretty spectacular

[04:10:08]

justinh:

whoah

[04:10:09]

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[04:10:10]

justinh:

I bet

[04:10:32]

wagnerrp:

i cant believe they could have done that

[04:10:45]

wagnerrp:

i mean theres no way some old woman in a caddy could have been going fast enough to do that

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wagnerrp:

but at the same time, thats the only way they could have collapsed the side in the van in the manner they did

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[04:32:15]

justinh:

heh my 'customer' is very happy with the box :)

[04:32:45]

justinh:

well at least with how it looks & how it's made. how it works is up to them to find out

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justinh:

"the theme so good it has its own website" ? lol

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justinh:

ouch. 16 results found for hd camcorder, Used. Is that all?!

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justinh:

hmm flip vs kodak. kodak wins

[05:21:22]

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[05:27:12]

AndyCap:

justinh: do they call them camcorders?

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justinh:

/ignore Agrajag I think

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[05:33:20]

justinh:

jees man

[05:33:40]

justinh:

can somebody op his backside outta here for a while please?

[05:34:01]

justinh:

AndyCap: been undecided about whether to go for 'pocket

[05:34:23]

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[05:34:32]

justinh:

err.. 'pocket' or 'traditional'.. but I figure the pocket ones are so cheap I can use one to tide me over til I get a real one ;-)

[05:35:32]

Gumby:

hi all. Is there a way to specify a preference for HD channels when creating a recording schdule? I'm doing my scheduling via mythweb but I dont see the option (but Iam getting tired and might be going blind)

[05:36:03]

justinh:

in mythtv-setup somewhere is a setting to prefer HD

[05:36:10]

justinh:

think it's in mythtv-setup anyway

[05:37:33]

Gumby:

ok. I will do some searching. thank you

[05:39:37]

justinh:

thinking about it, it's more likely in mythfrontend

[05:40:42]

Gumby:

I can set the HD channel to a higher priority it seems

[05:41:15]

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[05:41:43]

justinh:

heh it used to be a simple setting to enable/disable prioritisation of HD shows

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[05:42:10]

justinh:

but note shows still have to be marked as 'hd' in the epg

[05:43:11]

justinh:

heh. Seems Agrajag- is very aptly named

[05:43:49]

Gumby:

justinh: where did you read that from?

[05:44:10]

justinh:

I remember it was a simple toggle setting

[05:44:12]

Gumby:

the enable/disable prioritisation of HD

[05:44:13]

Gumby:

ah

[05:44:18]

Gumby:

thought yoy just quoted it

[05:44:26]

justinh:

but in a later release – I dunno when – somebody gave it a number

[05:44:37]

justinh:

not being a user of HD it escaped my gaze

[05:44:55]

Gumby:

"Addition Priority when a showing is marked as an HDTV broadcast in the TV listings"

[05:45:04]

justinh:

and now I'm struggling to remember if lower numbers mean higher priority or not

[05:45:05]

Gumby:

additional

[05:45:18]

Gumby:

higher means more priority from what I am reading

[05:45:38]

Gumby:

looks like mine is already set that way. hooray.

[05:45:38]

justinh:

that's what I always remember too, but recently saw something to the contrary

[05:45:38]

Gumby:

hehe

[05:46:03]

Gumby:

"For example, say CNN is on analog channel 20 and there is an HD CNN on 750. You may not want to tie up the HD input for news originating in standard definition. Under TV Settings->Recording Priorities->Channel Priorities you could set channel 750 to -1. The scheduler would then prefer to record CNN shows on any analog channel 20 before considering using 750 only when there are no analog inputs available."

[05:46:28]

Gumby:

assuming ch.20 was > -1

[05:46:34]

gbee:

the HD prioritisation setting is buried, I think under the recording priorities section in the settings

[05:46:37]

Gumby:

it doesnt say. hehe

[05:46:42]

Gumby:

gbee: yes, that is where it is

[05:47:12]

gbee:

ah, missed the fact that you'd already found it

[05:47:36]

Gumby:

Utilities/Setup->Setup->TV Settings->Recording Priorities->Set Recording Priorities

[05:47:38]

Gumby:

first page

[05:47:43]

justinh:

yup

[05:47:46]

Gumby:

HDTV Recording Priority

[05:47:49]

gbee:

Gumby: so long as your guide data includes information on what is in HD you should be fine then :)

[05:47:59]

Gumby:

gbee: yep. Seems like it :)

[05:48:02]

Gumby:

thanks guys

[05:48:18]

justinh:

you could also use channel priorities I suppose

[05:48:29]

gbee:

I've only just suggested to Nick that the UK grabber includes that info, it currently doesn't

[05:48:59]

justinh:

heh. as if the HD channels show anything but HD ?

[05:49:12]

justinh:

oh wait I think Ch4 shows a lot of upscaled junk

[05:49:14]

gbee:

justinh: that's what I currently rely on, the net effect is much the same since HD programmes appear on HD channels, it doesn't really matter where the priority bump happens

[05:49:34]

justinh:

actually is 4HD FTA yet?

[05:50:18]

gbee:

justinh: well nothing can be done about that, afaik RT don't include details on what is/isn't HD vs upscaled, best we can do is insert the HD flag for all *HD channels

[05:50:29]

justinh:

true

[05:50:55]

justinh:

I'm still slightly concerned I don't give a stuff about HD. I must be getting old

[05:51:08]

gbee:

justinh: no and I think it's still questionable whether it ever will be, C4 have just given VM an exclusive on Film4 HD for example

[05:52:28]

justinh:

though looking at HD camcorders I must have some kind of eye on the future. been seriously disappointed with home video in the past. DV for example.. Meh

[05:52:55]

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[05:53:22]

justinh:

is that slice of junk they called FlashForward back in UK listings yet?

[05:53:33]

justinh:

and when the heck are Virgin1 gonna show new Chuck?

[05:53:33]

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[05:54:01]

gbee:

it might be junk, but I'm trying to pretend otherwise because there's naff all else to watch ;)

[05:54:10]

justinh:

heheh

[05:54:31]

gbee:

justinh: I might be alone in this, but having seen the output from a couple of HD cameras there is a significant difference in quality from one to the next

[05:54:44]

justinh:

it was a good job I didn't have anything like a half brick handy when I saw the last episode of FF

[05:54:52]

justinh:

or I'd have had to buy a new telly

[05:55:10]

gbee:

I can't recommend any, just be aware that just because it's stamped HD doesn't mean the video quality is what it should be

[05:55:23]

justinh:

gbee: I've been looking at loads of reviews. the pocket ones seem to be pretty good apart from those Flip thingies

[05:55:41]

justinh:

or rather, the flip ones look okay til you see the video quality of the kodak ones

[05:56:12]

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[05:56:38]

justinh:

a mate of mine has a Zi6 & it's pretty staggering how good the detail & colour rendition is

[05:57:06]

gbee:

justinh: cool, maybe they've improved some, I just can't stop comparing everything to BBC HD documentaries like Life/Planet Earth and that's probably unreasonable because their cameras cost tens of thousands

[05:57:21]

justinh:

heheh

[05:57:30]

justinh:

not to mention the lenses they have to use

[05:57:36]

justinh:

and the lighting

[05:58:16]

justinh:

plus I doubt I'd ever feel ok about strapping a Red HD camera to my bike handlebars ;-)

[05:58:23]

gbee:

well lighting in all those cases is the sun :)

[05:59:20]

justinh:

I'd be happy enough with 720p/60 for home videos. It's a massive step up from the 480p/30 my stills camera can do :)

[05:59:52]

gbee:

there has to be something said about the lenses, after all the only difference between a £200 pair of binoculars and an £800 pair are the lenses and yet people are consistently willing to buy the more expensive ones

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[05:59:57]

justinh:

yay Chuck S3 starts on march 22

[06:00:17]

gbee:

yay

[06:00:33]

justinh:

lenses make a hell of a difference on domestic gear

[06:00:50]

justinh:

doesn't matter how many megapixels you've got if the lens is a bit of bent plastic

[06:01:32]

justinh:

saw a video comparing a Flip Minos to a Kodak Zi model side by side & the Flip looked very blurry by comparison

[06:02:06]

justinh:

hmmm.. march 22.. should be in the guide already. let's see...

[06:02:16]

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[06:02:48]

justinh:

empty set :-(

[06:03:35]

gbee:

EIT?

[06:04:06]

justinh:

maybe I'll check

[06:04:20]

justinh:

nope

[06:04:50]

justinh:

select title, subtitle from program where title like "%chuck%" and chanid="1020"; strikes out

[06:05:08]

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[06:05:15]

justinh:

another site's saying 7th April

[06:05:35]

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[06:09:24]

justinh:

heh this is out on April 1st : http://gizmodo.com/5441046/kodak-playsport-ru . . . nder-the-sea

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[06:18:19]

xbmc:

channel ten puts a small white line accross bottom of screen how can i fix

[06:18:48]

justinh:

you can only fix stuff like that by overscanning the video

[06:18:52]

xbmc:

do i use scan displacement vertical

[06:19:19]

xbmc:

+1 or 2 or – 1 or 2

[06:19:32]

xbmc:

will that move the picture down

[06:19:38]

justinh:

try it & see

[06:19:48]

justinh:

it's not like you'll make your TV explode if you get it wrong

[06:20:02]

xbmc:

Ive treied a few and it makes no chnage maybe i try more drastic numbers

[06:21:43]

justinh:

maybe just try changing the video playback settings a little

[06:22:04]

gbee:

overscan using the video overscan options in myth, not the driver fwiw

[06:22:14]

xbmc:

i just tried scan displacemnet -30 on y and it mdae no diffrence....

[06:22:35]

justinh:

no what you need to do is make mythtv play back the video zoomed in a little

[06:22:49]

xbmc:

my screen is 1920x1080

[06:23:11]

justinh:

so?

[06:23:15]

xbmc:

ah ok I think thres something wrong with screen set up

[06:23:24]

justinh:

no it's not the screen setup

[06:23:39]

justinh:

broadcast video has junk at the edges sometimes

[06:23:49]

justinh:

yes, even 'HD'

[06:23:57]

xbmc:

when i use screen set up wizard it seems wrong...

[06:24:06]

justinh:

you don't use that

[06:24:23]

gbee:

the screen setup wizard adjusts the UI size, you want to only adjust the video

[06:24:25]

justinh:

that wizard is to make the GUI fit your screen

[06:24:43]

justinh:

go into utils/setup > setup > Tv settings > playback

[06:24:59]

xbmc:

yes this is wher i have ben adjusting

[06:25:04]

xbmc:

been sorry

[06:25:05]

justinh:

then around page 2 is a 'vertical scaling' and 'horizontal scaling' setting

[06:25:29]

justinh:

turn them up a little, both by the same amount

[06:25:52]

justinh:

see, this is one reason why sometimes making the computer output fit the edges of the TV isn't always a great idea :P

[06:26:36]

shiznix:

hi, is there a workaround to stop 'Watch TV' from showing a black mouse cursor in the middle of the screen ?

[06:26:40]

xbmc:

scaling is curently on 0 on both vert and horizontal

[06:26:55]

xbmc:

range is from -100 to +100 %

[06:27:04]

shiznix:

enabling/disabling 'Utilities/Setup > Setup > Appearance > Next > Hide Mouse Cursor in MythTV' has no effect

[06:27:20]

justinh:

shiznix: AFAIK it has no effect til you restart mythfrontend

[06:27:30]

justinh:

xbmc: so try putting some numbers in then. sheesh

[06:27:42]

justinh:

they always default to zero

[06:27:45]

xbmc:

yeh I am thnaks justin

[06:27:46]

shiznix:

justinh: i see, thanks :)

[06:28:06]

justinh:

christ, whaddya have to do around here – come round to your place & do this ourselves?!

[06:28:43]

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[06:29:10]

Hoxzer:

hmmmm

[06:30:01]

xbmc:

beers on me justin

[06:30:33]

xbmc:

just a long drive probably

[06:30:58]

shiznix:

ok, 'Hide Mouse Cursor' does work once mythfrontend is restarted, but mouse cursor shows itself as soon as 'Watch TV' is launched

[06:31:06]

xbmc:

fixed thankyyou

[06:31:19]

justinh:

shiznix: then you've a problem with your window manager, or the lack of one

[06:31:22]

justinh:

xbmc: cool :)

[06:32:00]

justinh:

xbmc: I'm amazed the broadcasters are still relying on overscan to cover up junk they put out over the air. going digital should/could have put a stop to all that

[06:32:11]

shiznix:

for the record, i don't want or have any mouse devices configured in xorg.conf

[06:32:29]

xbmc:

well Im in australia and iwe may be a bit backward

[06:32:42]

shiznix:

mythtv requires a WM now ?

[06:32:59]

xbmc:

then unplug your mouse

[06:33:28]

justinh:

xbmc: pah anywhere which places leisure activity so high on its priorities is far from backwards IMHO

[06:33:33]

shiznix:

heheh, i don't have a mouse

[06:33:40]

shiznix:

i don't want a mouse

[06:33:49]

shiznix:

i don't have a mouse configured anywhere

[06:33:51]

justinh:

more to the point you can't really even use a mouse in mythtv

[06:33:54]

xbmc:

well sport is very impoartant you know

[06:33:57]

justinh:

not fully

[06:34:04]

justinh:

xbmc: who said anything about sport? meh

[06:34:05]

xbmc:

have to sahow rest of world how its done

[06:34:19]

shiznix:

yet i have this annoying mouse pointer

[06:34:29]

justinh:

I said leisure not physical exertion :P

[06:34:52]

xbmc:

liesure ... sport kinda same for the young and fit

[06:35:50]

xbmc:

shiznix sure its not a xmbc mouse pointer?

[06:36:27]

xbmc:

as they have bad habit of causing grief

[06:36:53]

justinh:

leisure is what happens when you're not at work. It doesn't have to involve physical activity :-D

[06:37:22]

xbmc:

true ... I m on a 36 hr week

[06:37:37]

shiznix:

xbmc: not an xbmc mouse pointer

[06:37:37]

xbmc:

rostered day off today

[06:37:53]

xbmc:

yesterday public hoilday

[06:37:59]

xbmc:

lifes tough

[06:38:21]

shiznix:

but i do see something called 'unclutter' which may or may not get rid of it

[06:38:26]

xbmc:

4 day week end is nice

[06:38:43]

justinh:

what does an XBMC pointer setting have to do with mythtv though?

[06:39:20]

xbmc:

nothing justiinh it was a question of mine?

[06:39:55]

justinh:

reminds me I still need to extract the stupid ubuntu default devices out of xorg.conf

[06:40:05]

justinh:

who the hell owns a wacom tablet anyway?

[06:40:56]

xbmc:

text in osd does not fit what res is mythtv out off the box configed for?

[06:41:18]

xbmc:

or is simply guide datea provide to much info?

[06:41:22]

sid3windr:

justinh: my wife owns 2.. ;)

[06:48:14]

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[06:52:03]

justinh:

making text fit in all the boxes provided isn't easy

[06:52:22]

justinh:

you have to trade off between having text big enough to read & the amount of space you want to set aside onscreen :)

[06:52:39]

justinh:

sid3windr: I actually own one too, but making a touch tablet a default device is a bit backward IMHO

[06:53:11]

justinh:

since prolly about less than 1% of users will actually own/use one

[06:53:31]

sid3windr:

:)

[06:53:55]

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[06:56:43]

k-man:

is there any .22 themes that work well for SD?

[06:57:04]

justinh:

s/is/are/

[06:57:06]

justinh:

and no

[06:57:18]

justinh:

not IMHO

[06:57:23]

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[06:57:42]

k-man:

justinh: thanks for the correction

[06:57:55]

justinh:

if I liked horizontal menus I'd go for Metallurgy though

[06:58:13]

k-man:

ok, ill take a look at it

[06:58:37]

k-man:

thanks

[06:58:56]

justinh:

come to think, I don't think Terra has over-small text either

[06:59:03]

justinh:

but it's not 4:3

[06:59:25]

k-man:

hmm.. metallurgy seems to be wider than 4:3 too

[07:00:06]

justinh:

heh I forget the rest of the world think SD has to be 4:3

[07:00:22]

xbmc:

does mythbuntu diskless have native support for dvd drives on the cllients of do i have to do some magic

[07:00:37]

justinh:

ruh?

[07:00:55]

xbmc:

best for sd i would think would be mythcenter

[07:01:00]

k-man:

justinh: well, i guess i could have phrased my question better. i'm after a .22 4:3 SD theme

[07:01:01]

justinh:

I'd imagine optical drives just work out of the box like they do on everything else

[07:01:26]

justinh:

xbmc: pfft. can't wait to see that theme die a horrible death.

[07:01:46]

k-man:

xbmc: yeah, looks lime mythcenter has a 4:3 theme

[07:01:51]

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[07:01:58]

justinh:

mythcenter is NOT a true theme anyway

[07:02:10]

justinh:

all that was themed were the menus – little else

[07:02:17]

k-man:

oh

[07:02:26]

justinh:

so what you get is mostly default xml files

[07:02:57]

xbmc:

mythcenter should be default theme imho as you dont need opengl or anything for it to work fast

[07:03:02]

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[07:03:24]

xbmc:

its nice to get things working them stuff around with video drivers

[07:03:57]

k-man:

Project Grayhem seems quite ok

[07:04:24]

xbmc:

all other themes are like slow to operate and freeze up without opengl

[07:04:25]

gbee:

Project Grayhem no longer exists

[07:04:32]

k-man:

so can i upgrade to .22 even though i don't have an HDTV?

[07:04:38]

k-man:

gbee: it doesn't?

[07:04:44]

gbee:

and mythcenter isn't much more than a shell around the defaults

[07:04:50]

gbee:

k-man: nope

[07:05:02]

xbmc:

yes you can k-man

[07:05:13]

k-man:

gbee: ah, you might be right

[07:05:21]

k-man:

xbmc: and it will work?

[07:06:10]

xbmc:

you can run myyth on a p3 with 512 neg of ram on an ols crt tv if you want

[07:06:22]

xbmc:

old crt tv

[07:06:24]

gbee:

and everyone asked for Terra to be the default (wasn't my choice, nor my fault that it's fallen out of favour)

[07:06:48]

xbmc:

terra is the most horrid them ive ever seen

[07:07:05]

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[07:07:50]

gbee:

only 4:3 theme currently available for 0.22 is MythCenter, which as noted isn't so much a theme as a themed menu + fallback screens

[07:08:05]

Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +o gbee

[07:08:11]

shiznix:

yay me i fixed my mouse pointer problem

[07:08:11]

xbmc has been kicked from #mythtv-users by gbee!~gbee@cpc1-derb9-0-0-cust921.leic.cable.ntl.com (Goodbye!)

[07:08:15]

shiznix:

unclutter didn't work

[07:08:29]

Mode for #mythtv-users by gbee!~gbee@cpc1-derb9-0-0-cust921.leic.cable.ntl.com : -o gbee

[07:08:34]

shiznix:

but adding 'Option "HWCursor" "off"' to my xorg.conf did :D

[07:09:20]

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[07:09:39]

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[07:09:53]

xbmc:

why the kick?

[07:10:23]

gbee:

you hurt my feelings, you heartless jerk

[07:10:31]

k-man:

hehe

[07:11:08]

sphex:

hey. anyone tried to run mythfrontend with a remote X server over the network? when I try this the video is choppy as hell, but that's with mythfrontend running on the backend host which is an old pentium 4. any chance that this could work well with a faster computer?

[07:11:56]

sphex:

that's with a cygwin X server BTW

[07:12:05]

k-man:

sphex: imho, no

[07:12:22]

sphex:

awh

[07:12:34]

xbmc:

uh ohh you had something to do with terra? wel then its really not that bad its just the default colour scheme can the colur be changed?

[07:12:52]

xbmc:

spex run a diskless client

[07:13:39]

justinh:

if some users were nicer & didn't send me hate mail in the past I might still have continued to develop my junk

[07:13:54]

sphex:

xbmc: mehh.. that means buying things.. :/

[07:14:07]

xbmc:

no it dont?

[07:14:11]

xbmc:

what?

[07:14:17]

k-man:

justinh: sad to hear that

[07:14:24]

xbmc:

uthrow away your hdd

[07:14:26]

gbee:

Terra was meant to be a demo theme, an example of how different things could look vs the old UI, the colour was a deliberate choice (although I've come to hate it) because prior to that all themes for MythTV had been blue/black

[07:14:27]

justinh:

sphex: remote X server? like trying to send uncompressed video over a network? LOL

[07:14:29]

k-man:

why do people have that attitude?

[07:15:27]

justinh:

sphex: you do the sums! say 1280x1024 res, 32 bits colour, 60Hz ...1280x1024x32x60 bits per second...

[07:15:33]

sphex:

justinh: yeah. I thought gigabit ethernet might have been enough..

[07:15:36]

justinh:

nope

[07:15:45]

gbee:

but since it was the _only_ theme to use the new UI code, I was asked to make it the default, in return I've got endless insults, so I'm not in a great mood :)

[07:15:51]

justinh:

now time to join the rest of us on Planet Earth :)

[07:16:03]

bjd:

for what it's worth, i like terra :)

[07:16:12]

xbmc:

when that colur comes up on the screeni just wanna hurl and go back to mythcentre beautiful blue....

[07:16:24]

xbmc:

ready to be kicked....

[07:16:45]

justinh:

terra was never one of the themes that makes me want to pull my eyeballs out. Oh god no. At least one of the competition entries made me feel that way :)

[07:17:07]

justinh:

just saying it's not to your (lack of) personal taste is nicer

[07:17:18]

gbee:

to be fair, I only tried it on my HD tv the other night and the colour looks nothing like it does on my monitors, clearly one or the other needs calibrating ...

[07:17:39]

xbmc:

spex with diskless you throw away hardware.....

[07:17:39]

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[07:17:53]

xbmc:

what could you need?

[07:18:56]

justinh:

I can't wait to get rid of glass-wide

[07:19:08]

xbmc:

gbee I admire you for having a crack.. I dont have the time to set up myth properly let alone design a theme...

[07:19:33]

sphex:

hrm. what about running mythfrontend in Linux in VirtualBox? that way it's compressed video over the network.. but then the bottleneck could be the emulator's video device..

[07:19:45]

justinh:

sphex: what about NOT doing it because it's a stupid idea?

[07:20:00]

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[07:20:10]

xbmc:

spex if you have a MBE you simply boot your client and it works

[07:20:11]

sphex:

xbmc: hehehe.. right. :p well the thing is I'm trying to get mythfrontend on a windows computer. which needs a HDD a somewhat.

[07:20:24]

justinh:

pfft

[07:20:28]

justinh:

not necessarily

[07:20:52]

xbmc:

spex you press f11 during boot and it boot from back end

[07:20:53]

justinh:

it's possible to make a windows machine diskless too

[07:21:23]

sphex:

right ok. wouldn't help much with running mythfrontend on it though.

[07:21:32]

justinh:

arghhh our illustrious CEO wants a trailing USB socket on our diddy ickle DVR

[07:21:47]

justinh:

sphex: why does it have to be windows anyway?

[07:22:07]

xbmc:

spex all you do is boot from network and you have a completely functional linux pc wher you once sat playing with windows

[07:22:23]

xbmc:

switch off reboot woindows pc

[07:22:29]

xbmc:

easy

[07:22:32]

justinh:

if you really MUST run windows a reasonable halfway point would be to use XBMC as a myth frontend – if you're willing to miss some functionality

[07:22:48]

justinh:

prolly easier than trying to get a native windows mythfrontend to work

[07:23:56]

xbmc:

diskless or wubi i suppose if he love windows so much

[07:24:00]

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[07:24:22]

justinh:

bleh

[07:24:34]

justinh:

all the 'convenience' involved in rebooting.

[07:24:38]

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[07:25:07]

sphex:

xbmc: yeah.. I never liked rebooting so much. :p

[07:25:14]

xbmc:

painfull i suppose when windows take so long to boot.....lol

[07:25:52]

sphex:

justinh: ok, gonna check this out. thanks.

[07:27:46]

xbmc:

suggestion on a compact linux os to wakeonlan my MBE so I can reboot and start my diskless FE

[07:28:09]

xbmc:

wil a normal usb stick suffice?

[07:28:25]

xbmc:

or a cd be better

[07:28:32]

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[07:28:52]

sphex:

xbmc: BTW, I mostly need windows for games.. the rest I would prolly be fine with an emulator I guess.

[07:29:16]

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[07:29:20]

xbmc:

idea is to have network boot firrst boot preference and if it fail then boot from usb or cd

[07:31:50]

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[07:32:41]

xbmc:

suggestion on a compact linux os to wakeonlan my MBE so I can reboot and start my diskless FE

[07:32:47]

xbmc:

idea is to have network boot firrst boot preference and if it fail then boot from usb or cd

[07:32:57]

xbmc:

wil a normal usb stick suffice?

[07:33:03]

xbmc:

or a cd be better

[07:42:58]

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[07:49:39]

mzb:

xbmc: fwiw, one of the boxes I run trunk on is a cheap clone of an EPIA-M (ie: 1GHz)

[07:49:46]

sphex:

hrm. my mythbackend doesn't seem to like XBMC so much. "MainServer::HandleVersion – Client speaks protocol version 8 but we speak 40!"

[07:51:11]

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[07:51:18]

mzb:

_and_ I use blue-abstract-wide on it (4:3 @ 1024x768)

[07:51:23]

AndyCap:

sphex: you lag, you drag.

[07:52:02]

mzb:

mpeg2 playback gives ~60–70% idle

[07:52:41]

mzb:

(that's with PCI nVidia graphics as the onboard graphics doesn't have s-video)

[07:53:49]

mzb:

(and it's netboot/root)

[07:59:00]

mzb:

re: compact (ie: custom) OS, see http://live.debian.net/

[07:59:04]

mzb:

apt-get install live-helper

[07:59:56]

mzb:

or live-magic if you like point-'n'-shoot solutions

[08:03:38]

xbmc:

mzb you suggestiing to me?

[08:03:55]

mzb:

is that what you're after?

[08:04:08]

mzb:

(yes)

[08:04:52]

mzb:

allows for netboot, usb and/or cd

[08:04:57]

xbmc:

yeah i need to wakeon lan my backend/server then reboot diskless

[08:05:25]

mzb:

so why do you need media to boot from?

[08:05:58]

mzb:

can't you send magic packets from windows and then reboot?

[08:06:06]

xbmc:

my backend server doesnot run 24/7

[08:06:19]

xbmc:

only from say 4pm to midnight

[08:06:29]

mzb:

(might be easier if you had an openwrt router ;))

[08:06:32]

xbmc:

unless torenting till miday

[08:07:11]

mzb:

uhuh ... send wakeonlan magic from windows (must be a utility somewhere) then reboot

[08:07:28]

xbmc:

hmm i have been thiunking if i had a router that could run linux it could wake my server

[08:07:33]

xbmc:

no not windows

[08:07:37]

xbmc:

errrr!

[08:08:03]

xbmc:

when my diskless client goes loking

[08:08:09]

mzb:

err ... I assumed you had a windows desktop and a mythtv MBE

[08:08:15]

xbmc:

looking for dhcp serrver

[08:08:20]

mzb:

(MBE on separate machine)

[08:08:28]

mzb:

right?

[08:08:32]

xbmc:

no i have diskless mythbuntu client

[08:08:42]

xbmc:

on an asrock ion

[08:08:55]

xbmc:

and a MBE/server in shed

[08:09:14]

xbmc:

server however does not run 24/7

[08:09:58]

mzb:

so how about setting mythtv to control BIOS wakeup _and_ have wol?

[08:10:32]

xbmc:

mythtv cant run if its disk has no power

[08:10:58]

mzb:

so the nfs share for the diskless client is on the MBE?

[08:11:20]

xbmc:

yes cleint image is on mbe

[08:11:37]

xbmc:

no hdd in asrock frontend

[08:11:42]

xbmc:

soon!

[08:11:43]

mzb:

get yourself an openwrt router with a USB port

[08:12:18]

mzb:

a Netgear WGT634U (add a bigger heatsink) or an Asus WL500GP

[08:12:46]

mzb:

and make yourself a custom initrd which includes wol for the MBE, and a delay to wait for the rootfs

[08:13:00]

mzb:

but your images on a USB stick in the router

[08:13:04]

xbmc:

mzp I can make a cd with linus to boot if netboot fails wol dhcp(MBE) wait reboot frontend and irt can boot from back end

[08:13:06]

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[08:13:23]

mzb:

(I use old 32MB SD camera cards in SD/USB readers)

[08:13:35]

mzb:

messy

[08:13:57]

xbmc:

hwo long would a usb stick last

[08:13:58]

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[08:14:14]

xbmc:

it may only operate once a day

[08:14:14]

mzb:

longer than the box? ;)

[08:14:42]

mzb:

I've been using that single 32MB SD for years

[08:14:43]

xbmc:

so runing a small linux distro on a usb stick wont lkill it

[08:14:57]

mzb:

well ... you don't set it up like that

[08:15:22]

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[08:15:27]

mzb:

if all you wan't is a small (custom) "distro" then you essentially make a kernel and an initrd ... that's it

[08:15:55]

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[08:16:03]

mzb:

so when it boots from USB, it reads the kernel, reads the initrd and then executes (essentially) without writing to the USB stick

[08:16:12]

xbmc:

ok and have it wakeon lan MBE and wait a shortwhile then reboot

[08:16:46]

mzb:

yep ... or perhaps wait for a certain time and reboot if the nfs share becomes available

[08:17:32]

xbmc:

is there a way i coulkd have this smal os ping the MBE to test if its awake and up and runing?

[08:17:59]

xbmc:

yes what you just said.. my bad

[08:18:05]

mzb:

yep, scripts in the initrd

[08:18:19]

xbmc:

only 1 little probl;em now

[08:18:37]

mzb:

you don't need a "rootfs" as such ... it could all execute from the initrd (loaded in memory)

[08:18:45]

xbmc:

how to make a kernel aand that other thing....

[08:18:47]

xbmc:

lol

[08:18:55]

mzb:

and it's more than just ping ... you wan't to make sure that the NFS is available

[08:19:08]

xbmc:

hmmm

[08:19:28]

mzb:

debian-live would make it all fairly easy ... although with that method you would have something a lot larger than you need

[08:19:57]

xbmc:

this kernal and initrd would boot very fast wouldnt it

[08:20:18]

xbmc:

arch?

[08:20:36]

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[08:20:36]

mzb:

you'll probably find the read speeds when booting from USB are quite slow

[08:21:01]

mzb:

but I doubt you'd really notice it

[08:21:17]

xbmc:

yes but still with so little to do it would only be say 20 seconds beofre it wols...

[08:21:26]

xbmc:

or fatsre

[08:22:02]

xbmc:

so i go steal a tomato?

[08:22:15]

xbmc:

and modify it?

[08:22:35]

mzb:

have a look at creating your own, or "remastering" ... all you'd need to do is write a small script which is executed from rc.local

[08:23:17]

xbmc:

rc.loacl was my starting point and a script

[08:23:25]

xbmc:

local sorry

[08:23:32]

mzb:

not the smallest solution, but probably the easiest

[08:23:52]

xbmc:

but do all distros have rc.loca?

[08:24:14]

mzb:

no

[08:24:41]

mzb:

there is tiny linux (5MB?) but you'll probably find that harder to work with. Also T2.

[08:25:03]

xbmc:

that sounds good

[08:25:07]

mzb:

but if you've already played with mythbuntu I suggest you try live-helper

[08:25:17]

xbmc:

not that much to so sh shouldnt be that bad...

[08:25:42]

xbmc:

ok live helper wil have a look

[08:25:50]

mzb:

much easier to get various things talking in the same language if you use a similar/same distro

[08:25:52]

xbmc:

thanks very much

[08:25:54]

justinh:

I used mythbuntu for my diskless FE. It's a lot less like mythbuntu though :)

[08:25:56]

mzb:

(eg: nfs)

[08:26:01]

justinh:

since I got my hands on it I mean :D

[08:26:07]

mzb:

:)

[08:26:17]

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[08:26:55]

mzb:

I'm still happy with Lenny on my mythboxen

[08:27:11]

xbmc:

i have mythbuntu server and diskless cliient front ends

[08:27:25]

xbmc:

mythbuntu clinets

[08:27:37]

xbmc:

my spelling is hsite tonight

[08:27:57]

mzb:

drink milk instead of wine? ;)

[08:29:33]

xbmc:

mzb live helper ? is it called debian live helper?

[08:29:46]

mzb:

yep

[08:29:49]

mzb:

iirc

[08:30:01]

xbmc:

got in in goolge thanks

[08:30:24]

mzb:

http://wiki.debian.org/DebianLive/Howto/USB

[08:33:45]

mzb:

$ apt-cache search live-helper

[08:35:49]

xbmc:

thanks again mzb bed time for me now....

[08:36:12]

mzb:

k, gnite

[08:37:05]

xbmc:

night!

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[09:04:26]

justinh:

sphex: you know why? XBMC doesn't truly know what protocol version to speak – rather it's not hard-coded as a true frontend is, so it guesses until the backend gives it the ok

[09:04:47]

justinh:

it's a bit messy but apparently works

[09:05:29]

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[09:08:19]

clever:

mzb: with my own bootable usb stick it usualy takes under 30 seconds to reach rc.local

[09:08:39]

justinh:

about what my diskless FE takes :)

[09:08:51]

mzb:

yep ... like I said ;)

[09:09:14]

clever:

my nfs booting systems are all ubuntu, so they have extra bloat that gentoo never had to start with

[09:09:47]

mzb:

either way, loading the kernel+initrd are quite slow (I think it's to do with lack of "USB2" smarts in the bootloader)

[09:10:16]

clever:

i dont think grub even supports usb at all, i think its the 'usb emulation' in the bios

[09:10:20]

justinh:

I dunno how much whizz-bang the next ubuntu release is gonna be

[09:10:39]

justinh:

some blogs I've seen quote stupidly fast boot times

[09:10:49]

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[09:12:11]

clever:

ubuntu nfs booting took ~88–255 seconds to hit rc.local (its all over the place)

[09:12:50]

justinh:

heh. it wasn't so hot til I got my hands on it either

[09:13:00]

justinh:

I did some.. modifying :)

[09:14:06]

clever:

forgot, the usb doesnt log that yet

[09:16:47]

justinh:

pfff I've got to find a USB mini 'B' to 'A' socket lead

[09:17:38]

justinh:

stupid PHB says it's got to be a trailing socket hanging out of the unit on a captive cable :-\

[09:28:02]

justinh:

heh mini 'b' plug (right angled) to 'A' socket. Yeah good luck with that

[09:32:09]

clever:

got one of those right angled ones

[09:32:15]

clever:

it came with our GPS

[09:35:42]

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[09:39:11]

sphex:

justinh: ok, yeah, makes sense since apparently that wasn't the problem. the problem was that I'm a dumbass and had my "backend addresses" set to localhost. anyway, works now!

[09:42:07]

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[10:04:46]

justinh:

clever: oh I know you can buy ready made cables with right angle mini 'B' plugs. We use em here

[10:04:56]

justinh:

and right angled 'A' plugs..

[10:05:19]

justinh:

but a right angled mini 'B' plug to 'A' socket... stretching things a bit

[10:05:22]

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[10:05:46]

justinh:

the best part is it has to fit through a hole in a front panel

[10:05:59]

justinh:

I'll have to use my shrinking machine

[10:06:42]

mag0o:

picket knife + electrical tape

[10:06:57]

justinh:

no cable joins allowed

[10:07:35]

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[10:09:23]

justinh:

sorry, did I just pour cold water on your idea? ;-) this guy needs a hard smack in the chops

[10:11:20]

mag0o:

drill bit just a little bigger than the plug + front hole panel :)

[10:12:06]

justinh:

nope, not enough room

[10:12:17]

justinh:

you're underestimating the PHB's fail

[10:13:12]

mag0o:

hehe

[10:13:13]

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[10:13:38]

justinh:

my boss already suggested the best way to the PHB. i.e. to fit a panel mounted socket. but no

[10:14:01]

Dibblah:

You need a rubber insert.

[10:14:22]

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[10:14:25]

toxster:

hi, is there any way of distributing commflagging? i.e run it on the frontend

[10:14:31]

justinh:

Dibblah: not enough room for one of the required diameter

[10:14:54]

justinh:

toxster: yeah run a slave tunerless backend on the frontend machine. like it says in the wiki/docs

[10:14:57]

Dibblah:

justinh: I think you misunderstood my suggestion. http://theballwhisk.files.wordpress.com/2007/ . . . -webbing.jpg

[10:15:16]

justinh:

lol

[10:15:33]

justinh:

polythene bag, zip ties...

[10:15:41]

justinh:

and a lorryload of concrete

[10:16:14]

toxster:

ahh sweet

[10:16:40]

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[10:16:40]

justinh:

toxster: it won't distribute commflagging jobs as such though. still only one job per host

[10:17:01]

justinh:

or X jobs per host at a time, not one job split across yay many hosts

[10:18:28]

toxster:

ok, so i can set simul jobs to 0 on my master and have the slave run all jobs?

[10:18:36]

toxster:

for instance

[10:18:40]

justinh:

yup

[10:18:46]

clever:

toxster: thats exactly what i do

[10:19:02]

toxster:

does it put the job on the master as "first" node to start a job?

[10:19:05]

justinh:

not that commflagging is even worth a light where I live

[10:19:09]

toxster:

if i have 1 on the master

[10:19:29]

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[10:19:53]

toxster:

i have a commflag running not @ 3.888fps, normal ?

[10:19:56]

toxster:

(its HD)

[10:20:04]

toxster:

s/not/now

[10:20:17]

clever:

each backend checks every 60 seconds (by default) and whichever one finds the job first, gets to run it

[10:20:22]

iamlindoro:

Depending on bitrate, codec, and the box that's running it, could be perfectly normal

[10:20:41]

justinh:

and good luck getting commflagging to work much in Europe

[10:20:50]

justinh:

YMMV

[10:21:11]

toxster:

really? I ran it a while ago when I used analog tv, worked flawless

[10:21:29]

justinh:

depends how the commercials are broadcast

[10:21:39]

toxster:

myth 0.20 if i remember correctly

[10:21:47]

justinh:

in the UK it fails for the vast majority of channels

[10:21:59]

toxster:

:/

[10:22:25]

justinh:

confuses the detection algorithms :)

[10:22:43]

justinh:

I very much doubt it's deliberate

[10:23:24]

toxster:

hmm what table does it store the cuts in i have one job thats finished

[10:23:28]

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[10:23:45]

clever:

toxster: recordedmarkup i think

[10:23:46]

toxster:

i doubt .se should be any different from the uk?

[10:23:56]

squidly:

morning

[10:24:02]

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[10:24:10]

Dibblah:

Every countries ads are different.

[10:24:18]

justinh:

toxster: you'd be surprised

[10:24:27]

justinh:

I've seen Spanish TV

[10:24:35]

justinh:

[10:24:56]

toxster:

27 rows in set (0.01 sec)

[10:25:12]

clever:

toxster: its keyed by starttime and chanid

[10:26:07]

toxster:

it seems to have found something, gotta check when i get back home

[10:26:35]

justinh:

all bets are off :)

[10:26:45]

toxster:

:)

[10:26:52]

justinh:

I never said commflagging didn't 'find' ad breaks over here

[10:27:04]

justinh:

it does, sure. but generally in all the wrong places

[10:27:39]

justinh:

stuff like logo detection works brilliantly where there's not much screen junk – assuming the logo is taken off for the breaks

[10:27:51]

justinh:

that accounts for maybe 10% of UK TV channels

[10:28:16]

justinh:

aspect ratio changes would be flawless too, but then there's not much of that going on either

[10:29:00]

justinh:

thankfully a lot of our breaks are consistent lengths so we can set up playback profiles to jump by just the right amount when we hit a button :)

[10:35:11]

toxster:

hehe

[10:35:17]

toxster:

that another way of solving it

[10:36:22]

justinh:

at least mythtv has arbitrary relative skipping :)

[10:36:43]

justinh:

the *only* media software which does AFAIK

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[10:58:17]

andreax:

Okay i shooted the problem from yesterday with sudo in mythfrontend/welcome. I typed in all halt commands in sudo, except "poweroff" – now its working. Thanks to sphery again. :)

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[11:03:33]

benomatic:

so i'm moving from the US -> Netherlands in a couple months... I currently run a single hauppauge hvr-1600. anybody have a clue whether this will work there or whether I need new hardware?

[11:04:51]

iamlindoro:

It will not work there, you will need new hardware

[11:05:08]

iamlindoro:

US uses ATSC/NTSC, europe uses DVB-T/PAL

[11:05:10]

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[11:06:32]

benomatic:

iamlindoro: suggestions on where to start, afa understanding what i can use? i'm completely ign'ant about digital/cable standards + hw.

[11:07:35]

iamlindoro:

http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/DVB-T_Devices will give you a list of supported terrestrial (antenna) devices, http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/DVB-S_Devices and http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/DVB-S2_Devices to use satellite

[11:08:10]

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[11:08:20]

iamlindoro:

http://www.dvb.org/about_dvb/dvb_worldwide/netherlands/ for general info on DVB in the Netherlands

[11:08:30]

benomatic:

gracias. my biggest problem has been that nearly all pages i've foudn are in dutch... which i don't (yet) speak.

[11:08:51]

iamlindoro:

Find a nice dutch girl to motivate you

[11:09:38]

iamlindoro:

It's germanic so as a speaker of english you'll pick it up quick

[11:09:47]

iamlindoro:

but that's neither here nor there, I guess :)

[11:10:26]

iamlindoro:

anykey_: Ping

[11:11:10]

benomatic:

iamlindoro: hopefully so, as to picking it up. although my adorable wife might object to some kinds of lessons :)

[11:11:41]

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[11:11:45]

iamlindoro:

Tell her it's how the europeans are, and that the other guys will laugh at you if you don't have a mistress

[11:11:48]

iamlindoro:

;)

[11:12:01]

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[11:12:04]

andreax:

Dutch is a funny language. Both our countries are neighbours (im from germany) but i dont speak any word dutch... :)

[11:12:35]

anykey_:

iamlindoro: hum?

[11:12:43]

iamlindoro:

anykey_: is http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/4426 you?

[11:13:01]

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[11:13:06]

anykey_:

yeah

[11:13:36]

iamlindoro:

anykey_: Can you check out http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/7923 please? I suspect that's a dupe, but the later ticket actually appears to have a solution

[11:14:13]

anykey_:

iamlindoro: no sorry, I no longer have the card and the CI :(

[11:14:21]

iamlindoro:

anykey_: ok, no worries

[11:15:09]

anykey_:

I needed a solution right back then and went the grey way, so...

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[11:27:22]

justinh:

thewhatwaynow? :-O

[11:28:22]

anykey_:

justinh: the softcam-way, with a patch to disable the load-keys-from-file feature

[11:28:49]

justinh:

seems all-white to me, that

[11:29:29]

anykey_:

well, the CA-systems certainly are protected by many many patents ;)

[11:29:39]

justinh:

well, looks like home time at this side. ttfn etc

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[12:20:33]

rkuris:

justinh: There have been recent fixes in commercial detection in 0.22; I had to upgrade to svn r23670 to fix it for any of my highdef programs

[12:21:24]

rkuris:

justinh: This was probably fixed by one or more of revisions 23514, 23515 and 23527.

[12:22:06]

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[12:22:08]

iamlindoro:

rkuris: He's not referring to any recent bug

[12:22:30]

iamlindoro:

He's referring to the fact that the editing of UK broadcasts make out commercial flagging methods useless/error-prone

[12:22:34]

iamlindoro:

s/out/our/

[12:23:11]

jarle:

By a mistake I ran mythrename.pl and now a lot of my recordings have problems playing back as the filename contains non-english chars, is there a tool I can use to rename the files back to the original myth-way?

[12:24:47]

wagnerrp:

'mythrename.pl --rename' or something like that

[12:24:57]

wagnerrp:

theres some argument you can give it to rename them back to stock

[12:25:21]

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[12:26:03]

jarle:

wagnerrp: google tolde me: mythrename.pl --format "%c_%Y%m%d%i%s"

[12:26:50]

wagnerrp:

no, theres something easier than that

[12:27:47]

jarle:

seems like other people had the same problem as me: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/commits/406871

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[12:28:54]

wagnerrp:

anyway, mythlink will do --rename

[12:29:03]

wagnerrp:

i thought that was old mythrename behavior too

[12:30:42]

wagnerrp:

yeah, it exists in the old version too

[12:31:31]

wagnerrp:

maybe not...

[12:34:19]

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[12:58:49]

jarle:

is there any reason NOT to use mythlink.pl with 0.22-fixes?

[12:59:09]

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Mode for #mythtv-users by ChanServ!ChanServ@services. : +v kormoc

[12:59:27]

iamlindoro:

No

[12:59:37]

jarle:

iamlindoro: good

[12:59:42]

iamlindoro:

:)

[12:59:49]

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[13:00:07]

jarle:

iamlindoro: allways afraid to mess up the db :)

[13:00:37]

wagnerrp:

there really havent been many database changes that could cause things to be messed up

[13:00:47]

wagnerrp:

i dont believe there have been any regarding the recording tables

[13:01:15]

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[13:53:50]

justinh:

is it just me or is there something wrong with mythweb's stats page?

[13:54:18]

justinh:

soaps are easily the most recorded shows in this house & yet they don't figure in the top 10 recorded shows

[13:55:03]

justinh:

hmm maybe it's cos I cleared out oldrecorded a while back

[13:55:56]

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[13:57:04]

wagnerrp:

working fine for me

[13:57:34]

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[13:59:48]

justinh:

heh Total Running Time: 4 years 2 months 9 days 23 hrs 46 mins

[13:59:49]

justinh:

Total Recorded: 8 months 23 days 12 hrs 57 mins

[14:00:40]

iamlindoro:

Mmm, gestational period of one (1) human

[14:03:22]

justinh:

heh

[14:03:24]

clever:

Incompatible protocol version (mythweb=56, backend=45)

[14:03:31]

clever:

dang, i need to upgrade my backend

[14:03:36]

clever:

or downgrade web

[14:03:46]

wagnerrp:

isnt 45 pre-22?

[14:03:56]

justinh:

you should know that kind of stuff by now without needing a plugin to tell you

[14:04:06]

clever:

0.22.20090424–2 20684M trunk

[14:04:45]

wagnerrp:

sounds about release

[14:06:03]

clever:

was there a page explaining how to work around the alsa problems?

[14:06:23]

wagnerrp:

which would be?

[14:06:36]

clever:

the alsa libs on ubuntu are too old for mythtv to compile

[14:08:01]

wagnerrp:

how old of ubuntu are you running?

[14:08:15]

clever:

8.04

[14:08:28]

iamlindoro:

I will rue the day that we need a page with "workarounds" for the issue of needing the dependencies installed

[14:08:33]

iamlindoro:

oh for crying out loud

[14:09:04]

clever:

it was something about how to install the latest alsa libs without updating the entire kernel

[14:09:06]

iamlindoro:

compile your own alsa, upgrade to something newer than 24 months old, or at the very least stop talking before I ban you

[14:09:33]

iamlindoro:

*** FLAGRANT ABUSE OF POWER PENDING ***

[14:09:37]

clever:

ok, something 23 months old? :P, which version does it need to be?

[14:09:54]

iamlindoro:

You're compiling trunk, read the commint message that made it q requirement

[14:10:08]

stuartm is now known as gbee

[14:10:09]

iamlindoro:

I'll even give you a hint that it occurred in the last two weeks

[14:10:21]

clever:

ive had this problem for over 2 weeks

[14:10:22]

iamlindoro:

s/commint/commit/

[14:10:35]

iamlindoro:

Yes, but the check in configure is less than two weeks old

[14:10:37]

wagnerrp:

the problem has existed for some time

[14:10:42]

wagnerrp:

^^

[14:11:49]

wagnerrp:

wait... did you say yesterday that xbmc now requires opengl 2.0 to run?

[14:12:11]

iamlindoro:

yes

[14:12:25]

** iamlindoro suspects he knows the next question **

[14:12:35]

iamlindoro:

They don't support it any more

[14:12:47]

wagnerrp:

and so theres a guy in here _named_ xbmc this morning.... claiming mythcenter should be the default theme since its the only one that runs well without opengl

[14:12:55]

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[14:12:59]

iamlindoro:

Ah, wasn't the question I expected :)

[14:13:10]

iamlindoro:

Yeah, I read the scrollback, that guy was a dillweed

[14:13:27]

iamlindoro:

I expected "how can it work on an original xbox"

[14:14:08]

j-rod:

RDV_Linux: I'm apparently stupid, or missing something in the mythnetvision fedora package deps...

[14:14:11]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: http://wiki.xbmc.org/?title=XBMC_for_Linux_sp . . . _for_XBMC.3F

[14:14:19]

j-rod:

finally trying to make it work on a box at home

[14:14:21]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp: So I guess 1.3 + GLSL support will work

[14:14:24]

wagnerrp:

'xbmc> Terra sucks!'... 'xbmc has been kicked'... 'xbmc> Terra is not so bad'

[14:14:25]

wagnerrp:

HAH

[14:14:36]

iamlindoro:

heh, yeah

[14:14:40]

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[14:14:44]

clever:

found it

[14:15:11]

iamlindoro:

j-rod: What is your issue?

[14:15:37]

** iamlindoro doesn't mind pawning support off on RDV_Linux, but feels he may have some familiarity with it on account of having written it :) **

[14:15:42]

j-rod:

iamlindoro: http://fpaste.org/Az6Q/

[14:16:02]

RDV_Linux:

j-rod: Am also looking;)

[14:16:09]

j-rod:

python-pycurl and MySQL-python both installed

[14:16:18]

iamlindoro:

j-rod: Do you have the new bindings installed?

[14:16:19]

wagnerrp:

'i admire you for having a crack'... i cant fathom what that is supposed to mean

[14:16:31]

wagnerrp:

specifically something in the last month or so

[14:16:53]

** wagnerrp cant remember when the tmdb stuff got shifted over **

[14:17:13]

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[14:17:14]

j-rod:

oh hell. I suck.

[14:17:31]

j-rod:

I have the python bindings installed on my backend, but not on the frontend where I'm actually trying to run it.

[14:17:37]

** j-rod hangs head in shame **

[14:17:41]

iamlindoro:

!trout j-rod documentation reading fail

[14:17:41]

** MythLogBot slaps j-rod with a documentation reading fail trout on behalf of iamlindoro... **

[14:17:44]

iamlindoro:

;)

[14:17:52]

j-rod:

so the python bindings should probably be a dep of the mythnetvision package, no?

[14:18:05]

RDV_Linux:

j-rod: Are you using the very latest MNV? That is usually a misleading message for a MythDB connection issue. I think the message has been fixed with the last MNV commit.

[14:18:07]

iamlindoro:

yeah

[14:18:08]

wagnerrp:

if they are a separate package, and not included in mythtv proper... yes

[14:18:32]

wagnerrp:

they should be a dep for both MV and MNV now

[14:18:37]

wagnerrp:

as grabber scripts in both use them

[14:18:53]

j-rod:

yeah, much better now. okay, I'll update the package deps.

[14:19:48]

iamlindoro:

nice, glad it was simple

[14:20:30]

j-rod:

likewise

[14:20:46]

RDV_Linux:

j-rod: Can I mark you down for helping with a Fedora package for the next MNV utility? It is not ready yet but will be within a month for experimental testers. At least could I ask you questions?

[14:21:00]

j-rod:

RDV_Linux: absolutely

[14:21:16]

RDV_Linux:

Ok you are now on my list;) thanks

[14:21:16]

** iamlindoro is going to have to devote some real attention to MNV again if we ever manage to get this release out **

[14:21:58]

j-rod:

the espn360 rss feed is fail

[14:22:20]

wagnerrp:

j-rod: it only seemed to link me back to the main page whenever i tried it

[14:22:24]

j-rod:

tells you 'hey, you can watch this prog', but they all link back to the main UI

[14:22:34]

j-rod:

wagnerrp: heh, yep, exactly what I saw

[14:23:16]

j-rod:

plus, it uses the move networks player, not flash

[14:23:47]

iamlindoro:

In my fantasy land I would really love to be able to do what boxee does with this content

[14:23:55]

j-rod:

flash for the ui to get to the videos, but needs the additional plugin to actually play the videos.

[14:24:07]

j-rod:

I haven't looked at boxee in a while

[14:24:12]

iamlindoro:

namely, it pulls in a "control file" in javascript from boxee's servers that wraps their player controls around the flash ones

[14:24:26]

iamlindoro:

so that play/stop/ffwd all work where applicable

[14:24:33]

j-rod:

ah, yeah, that would be nice

[14:24:47]

iamlindoro:

I would need to collaborate with paul-h on that one, though, as I truly don't know where to begin-- web stuff is far from my strength

[14:25:24]

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[14:25:42]

wagnerrp:

should just be able to pull that from the grabber, rather than continually hitting services....

[14:25:59]

wagnerrp:

... or do you want it pulling off the server so people dont have to update things when sites change?

[14:26:37]

iamlindoro:

correct

[14:26:43]

iamlindoro:

They go one further, in fact

[14:27:00]

iamlindoro:

where we parse the data locally on each box, they do all the parsing and boxee headquarters, and push the library to people

[14:27:12]

iamlindoro:

er parsing at

[14:27:44]

wagnerrp:

well that would depend on the TOS i suppose

[14:28:04]

iamlindoro:

I don't think they care :)

[14:28:13]

wagnerrp:

fair enough

[14:28:19]

iamlindoro:

Their cotent metadata/etc. is clearly scraped in violation of many TOS

[14:28:32]

iamlindoro:

er content

[14:28:49]

wagnerrp:

wasnt there some form of localization in the youtube data as well?

[14:29:07]

iamlindoro:

They explain away the hulu stuff as "but we run it in a browser!" conveniently ignoring the other violation by stealing the textual info

[14:29:17]

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[14:29:40]

iamlindoro:

youtube data has a couple locale things-- MNV doesn't really use it yet, though I've done rudimentary parsing work for language

[14:29:42]

justinh:

gah my notebook's LCD inverter is going dodgy

[14:30:12]

wagnerrp:

justinh: i started losing the ballast in my primary monitor a couple months ago

[14:30:15]

justinh:

hope it's not the inductors

[14:30:20]

wagnerrp:

takes a good 30 seconds to 'warm up' in the morning

[14:30:26]

justinh:

seems like a light tap can fix it

[14:31:52]

jarle:

does mythtv use other suffixes for videos than .mpg and .nuv?

[14:32:06]

justinh:

nope

[14:32:08]

wagnerrp:

for recordings, not that i know of

[14:32:30]

wagnerrp:

do hdpvr stuff come out as mpg or ts?

[14:33:53]

justinh:

probably saved as .mpg though

[14:33:55]

jarle:

so... how do I regex match all files NOT starting with a number?

[14:34:00]

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[14:34:05]

wagnerrp:

what for?

[14:34:37]

iamlindoro:

yeah. HD-PVR is ts as .mpg

[14:35:10]

jarle:

deleting all the .png created for files that does not exist anymore (after running mythlink.pl --rename)

[14:35:34]

justinh:

hmm cos pngs take up so much room :)

[14:35:58]

wagnerrp:

'\w+.*.png'?

[14:36:10]

kormoc:

jarle: [a-zA-Z]*

[14:36:13]

wagnerrp:

only matches stuff that starts with a character

[14:36:40]

sphery:

or rm *.png and let the backend recreate the thumbs

[14:36:48]

jarle:

kormoc: this is the opposite of what I need...

[14:36:51]

sphery:

just don't forget the ".png" on that one !

[14:36:52]

wagnerrp:

no, nevermind

[14:36:58]

wagnerrp:

\w matches numbers too

[14:37:03]

kormoc:

<jarle> so... how do I regex match all files NOT starting with a number?

[14:37:13]

sphery:

rm *.png

[14:37:16]

kormoc:

[a-zA-Z]* does that

[14:37:25]

jarle:

kormoc: you are correct :)

[14:37:26]

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[14:37:31]

sphery:

why waste time trying to delete only the ones you don't need when the ones you do need will be recreated

[14:37:40]

wagnerrp:

kormoc: it should match everything shouldnt it? since '*' matches zero instances

[14:38:01]

kormoc:

wagnerrp: not with bash iirc

[14:38:03]

sphery:

the * isn't applied to the match

[14:38:19]

sphery:

only after, so one latin alphanumeric character followed by anything

[14:38:23]

kormoc:

yup

[14:38:25]

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[14:38:28]

sphery:

still, though, the /best/ solution is rm *.png

[14:38:43]

wagnerrp:

yeah, just let mythtv regenerate them as needed

[14:38:44]

sphery:

then go to watch recordings and see the magic of the appearing previews

[14:38:51]

justinh:

I still wish thumbs were never created at all :)

[14:38:59]

sphery:

it's much easier to mistype when you try to get fancy

[14:39:23]

sphery:

and rm [a-zA-Z] * is a /bad/ typo

[14:39:28]

kormoc:

indeed

[14:39:40]

kormoc:

so is rm * .png ;)

[14:39:45]

sphery:

true

[14:39:50]

sphery:

someone on the list did that oen

[14:40:01]

wagnerrp:

but at least it will warn you that '.png' was not found

[14:40:19]

sphery:

kormoc: feel like fixing an issue with the error page (I think the one that gives us 90% of our incomprehensible MythWeb tickets)

[14:40:38]

Jay2k1:

Hello. I still have the problem that I can't scan for channels with my hauppauge PVR-350. The scan screen appears and then nothing more happens, it says "scanning europe-west E0 no lock". Does that sound familiar to anyone?

[14:40:54]

wagnerrp:

are you running 0.22?

[14:40:55]

kormoc:

DELETE FROM oldrecord WHERE (oldrecord.starttime, oldrecord.chanid) = (SELECT starttime, chanid FROM recorded); is awesome to fix that rm * issue

[14:40:57]

justinh:

Jay2k1: analogue scanning won't work in 0.22

[14:41:00]

kormoc:

sphery: sure, what's up?

[14:41:19]

wagnerrp:

nor will analog scanning

[14:41:29]

kormoc:

(with a truncate recorded; as well)

[14:41:30]

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[14:42:02]

sphery:

Remember the "Failed opening required 'modules/_shared/tmpl/tmpl/header.php'" error (with the tmpl/tmpl that users are always complaining about)? I accidentally repro'd it last night.

[14:42:10]

kormoc:

yeah?

[14:42:16]

sphery:

It only happens when there's no DB or the DB info in the apache config is wrong. (forgot to restore my DB before I started up)

[14:42:23]

Jay2k1:

justinh: because of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mythtv/+bug/478048 ?

[14:42:24]

sphery:

I have a patch that fixes the double tmpl

[14:42:36]

sphery:

but it then gives "SQL Error: Table 'mythconverg.settings' doesn't exist [#1146] in /srv/www/htdocs/myth/classes/Database/Query/mysql.php on line 83"

[14:42:40]

sphery:

and I couldn't figure that one out

[14:42:45]

justinh:

Jay2k1: no, it just doesn't work. nothing to do with ubuntu

[14:42:57]

wagnerrp:

Jay2k1: no, because the scanner was rewritten prior to 0.22, and analog scanning suffered a regression

[14:43:01]

kormoc:

gotcha, I'll look into that one

[14:43:01]

wagnerrp:

it has since been fixed in trunk

[14:43:26]

wagnerrp:

so either upgrade to trunk and scan, wait a few weeks and upgrade to 0.23, or add the channels manually

[14:43:33]

justinh:

the button was disabled but that didn't prevent the scanner being invoked elsewhere

[14:43:39]

Jay2k1:

ah i see

[14:43:48]

pjcrux|DT:

hello all, I seem to have a problem with my mythtv recording settings. I can set a recording but it will not hold. Also mythtv does not display the previously recorded programs. Everything was ok till I ran a mythfilldatabase and the mythfilldatabase hung for over an hour I had to exit my putty session and reboot the machine. Any thoughts?

[14:44:04]

Jay2k1:

well then.. thanks anyway :)

[14:44:13]

wagnerrp:

pjcrux|DT: sounds like a database crash

[14:44:28]

wagnerrp:

see mysql instructions on recovering the database

[14:44:28]

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[14:44:39]

pjcrux|DT:

wagnerrp: ok thanks

[14:45:46]

justinh:

wow. my hatred of ubuntu just deepened some more :)

[14:46:16]

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[14:46:32]

wagnerrp:

how is that?

[14:47:04]

justinh:

stupid libata version I've got here. won't let me change dma modes

[14:47:14]

justinh:

inappropriate ioctl for device yada yada

[14:47:22]

wagnerrp:

still on that?

[14:47:47]

justinh:

need to either have a major kernel change, swap distro or move hardware to get round it I think

[14:48:32]

sphery:

kormoc: here's the patch I used to fix the double tmpl (but there's probably a more correct fix) -> http://misc.thirdcontact.com/MythTV/mythweb-fix_error_page.patch (looks like the tmpl is missing a $ ?). Note, also, that if there's no database at all, you get the nice error message in the browser window. If there's a completely empty mythconverg DB, you get the error message in the Apache error log.

[14:48:44]

sphery:

want me to put this info in a ticket for you?

[14:49:15]

kormoc:

Sure, and it's not missing a $, it's a define(), but if it's not defined yet (missing db would do that), php treats it as a string

[14:49:38]

kormoc:

but yeah, your code is very close :)

[14:50:04]

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[14:50:05]

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[14:50:17]

sphery:

yeah, figured there was more to it than I understood, but at least it found where the issue is.

[14:50:52]

sphery:

also, for the manual schedule page, I came up with http://misc.thirdcontact.com/MythTV/mythweb-7 . . . t_date.patch for the description, but I don't k

[14:50:56]

sphery:

now how to get the initial/default translation, so I get a "!!NoTrans:" warning.

[14:51:22]

sphery:

want it in 7057 ticket or would you rather teach me how to start the translation :)

[14:52:20]

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[14:52:24]

kormoc:

so cd into modules/_shared/translations and run build_translations.pl and that's pretty much it :)

[14:52:25]

sphery:

oh, also, if it's hard for you to test a missing or empty database, let me know--I can do the testing easily

[14:52:33]

sphery:

nice... :)

[14:52:40]

kormoc:

kk

[14:54:00]

sphery:

iamlindoro: So, regarding that patch--it adds one new translatable string to MythWeb. Think it's best to hold it 'til after release (since all the translators just finished)? I don't think it's really that important, so waiting isn't a problem IMHO.

[14:54:17]

slipcon:

sphery: have some time to help with the database corruption we were emailing about last night?

[14:54:21]

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[14:54:26]

sphery:

slipcon: cool, you're here

[14:54:43]

sphery:

slipcon: yeah, perfect time--I just dropped my DB to redo the tests for explaining the issue I found to kormoc !

[14:55:10]

sphery:

got a link to a right-now DB? Feel free to PM it to me to keep it out of channel (and away from web crawlers)

[14:55:36]

sphery:

I was afraid I missed you earlier, so I'm glad you're here, now.

[14:55:37]

slipcon:

sure let me upload it

[14:55:49]

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[14:57:24]

iamlindoro:

sphery: Meh, probably not that big a deal, but no strong feelings either way

[14:58:11]

sphery:

ok, thanks for the input

[14:58:46]

sphery:

I may hold it, anyway. It does uglify the nice pretty page we currently have.

[14:59:45]

iamlindoro:

yeah, I think holding it is probably good

[14:59:57]

iamlindoro:

then we can sweep through early in the .24 cycle and clean up stuff like that

[15:01:51]

sphery:

yeah, plus someone else may come up with a way to a) show the start date only for single and weekly manual records and b) show a 5 weekdays/7 days per week radio button group only for daily manual records

[15:02:08]

sphery:

so, maybe the users will never see the ugly version I did :)

[15:03:10]

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[15:03:53]

sphery:

slipcon: that one upgrades just fine for me, too

[15:04:07]

sphery:

slipcon: are you using current 0.22-fixes?

[15:04:37]

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[15:04:40]

Little_Ted:

hello mythtv, can I ask someone some basic questions about configuration here?

[15:04:49]

justinh:

Little_Ted: just ask. don't ask to ask

[15:05:05]

slipcon:

i'm using what gentoo has.... 0.22_p23069

[15:06:08]

sphery:

r23069, should be recent enough that it's not a problem in the upgrade (and, really, the only problem was in the upgrade test and only with the people table)

[15:06:29]

sphery:

any chance you feel like running current trunk?

[15:06:38]

sphery:

If so, I can just give you the upgraded DB.

[15:06:53]

sphery:

If not, I'd have to compile and install -fixes to get you an upgraded DB

[15:07:03]

slipcon:

I'd rather stick with the gentoo packages to make life easier down the line, if possible.

[15:07:06]

sphery:

or would need access to your system (an ssh or something)

[15:07:25]

Little_Ted:

okay. I have bought a HTPC for my father and he is very eager to have a PVR system, and he has been using an xbox running XBMC for a couple of years so is used to the interface. I have no experience in Linux and there seems to be many options, so I was wondering a) if it is possible to install some system that can boot into XBMC by default and utlise MythTV and b) what is the least...

[15:07:27]

Little_Ted:

...challenging method of doing this?

[15:07:39]

slipcon:

when you say it upgrades fine are you doing a full upgrade or the partial?

[15:07:55]

sphery:

the partial after the partial-corruption fix

[15:08:00]

sphery:

the initial DB fails upgrade

[15:08:12]

wagnerrp:

Little_Ted: you have two options, neither of which are particularly good

[15:08:32]

wagnerrp:

you can set up mythbackend, and continue running XBMC using the mythbox plugin to access the backend

[15:09:01]

slipcon:

ok.... in one ofthe mailing lists I found a perl script that checks 4 tables, the people table has a lot of warnings, as does oldprogram, but recorded and oldrecorded each have 1.

[15:09:06]

sphery:

slipcon: let's try this... Download the current mythconverg_restore.pl and see if it works properly with that (it's possible that you have an old version)... Actually, what does mythconverg_restore.pl --version give?

[15:09:11]

wagnerrp:

however the mythbox plugin tends to be outdated, does not get properly updated to match changes in myth protocol, ,and lies about what version its using to continue doing so

[15:09:40]

wagnerrp:

or you can run mythtv as the base program, and add a menu entry to load xbmc over top of it

[15:09:45]

slipcon:

MythTV Database Restore Script

[15:09:45]

slipcon:

mythconverg_restore.pl

[15:09:45]

slipcon:

version: 1.0.8.1

[15:09:50]

sphery:

The current (1.0.12) version of the restore script (from trunk) is at http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/browser/trunk/myth . . . l?format=txt and will work fine with 0.22-fixes. You can even just put it in your local dir.

[15:10:00]

slipcon:

let me grab that

[15:10:00]

sphery:

hmmm... 1.0.8.1 should be fine

[15:10:06]

sphery:

still, worth a try

[15:10:11]

wagnerrp:

Little_Ted: or you can just drop xbmc completely, and teach him to use myth's UI

[15:10:14]

slipcon:

could it be the version of mythconverg_backup?

[15:10:27]

sphery:

I don't think so.

[15:10:41]

slipcon:

because that was definitely old... gentoo's 0.21 package didn't include it so I had downloaded it a while ago

[15:10:46]

Little_Ted:

do you think that myth's UI can be made as parent-friendly as XBMC?

[15:11:01]

justinh:

ouch

[15:11:11]

wagnerrp:

my parents use it just fine

[15:11:16]

sphery:

slipcon: actually, couldn't be that--since I used the backup that you created with it. :)

[15:11:23]

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[15:11:23]

wagnerrp:

they dont know their way around the configuration pages, but then they dont need to either

[15:11:23]

slipcon:

right, good point

[15:11:39]

sphery:

Little_Ted: I think Myth's UI is /much/ more friendly than XBMC for all things TV.

[15:12:13]

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[15:12:14]

sphery:

for non-TV, it's just a slightly different interface (so it will require some learning), but it's a /very/ nice interface in 0.22 and above

[15:12:20]

sphery:

(at least for videos :)

[15:12:42]

Little_Ted:

cool, I read that many of the modules in MythTV weren't up to the quality of XBMC for things like music and video playback, but it was a post from a few years back, so is that not valid these days?

[15:12:50]

wagnerrp:

yeah, music and pictures could stand to use some work

[15:13:03]

wagnerrp:

videos got a huge revamp in 0.22

[15:13:10]

sphery:

slipcon: if the new restore script doesn't help, I'll walk you through the steps to identify the bad data.

[15:13:23]

sphery:

(I'm willing to do that in IRC, but not via e-mail :)

[15:13:29]

justinh:

I wish people would get the hell off mythtv's back. criticising is NOT contributing

[15:13:50]

justinh:

mythtv is as good as its contributors make it & we're bloody lucky to have the guys we've got

[15:14:24]

Little_Ted:

thankyou all. just as general options, how do you think WIndows 7's media centre (on Ultimate version) compares with using MythTV as the default UI

[15:14:34]

slipcon:

2010-03–09 14:14:20.962 Database corruption detected. Unable to proceed with database upgrade. (Table: oldrecorded, Warnings: 1)

[15:14:45]

wagnerrp:

have it... never used it

[15:14:45]

justinh:

MCE sucks. end of story. they messed it up with that cross menu thing

[15:14:55]

kormoc:

Little_Ted: the number of us who ever used windows 7 is going to be fairly small

[15:15:12]

** AndyCap used the beta **

[15:15:13]

justinh:

plus it's less of a 10" interface than anything else I've seen. text is way too small for mortals

[15:16:14]

Little_Ted:

I thought as much. I think I will try and install MythTV as the basic UI as you have suggested. Is there a particular package that would be easiest for me to use?

[15:16:21]

sphery:

slipcon: hmmm... upgrades for me when doing the partial restore onto the blank DB using the 1.0.8.1 restore script

[15:16:32]

wagnerrp:

are you familiar with linux?

[15:16:38]

Little_Ted:

not at all

[15:16:40]

justinh:

if you're looking for 'easy' then go with something else. if you're looking for *worthwhile* stick around

[15:16:52]

wagnerrp:

mythbuntu is probably your best bet then

[15:16:56]

Little_Ted:

I understand, I meant within the spectrum of worthwhile

[15:17:16]

justinh:

nothing to do with mythtv is ever point & click easy put it that way :)

[15:17:22]

slipcon:

hm. there must be some difference.... mysql version?

[15:17:26]

** dustybin likes mythtv **

[15:17:36]

wagnerrp:

understand that learning both linux AND mythtv at the same time is going to cause a lot of heartache

[15:17:45]

dustybin:

mythtv is finished, why are they releasing another version ? :D

[15:17:54]

wagnerrp:

i would highly suggest playing around with it a bit on a spare box and get comfortable

[15:17:54]

justinh:

users who read docs & ask intelligent questions go farthest :)

[15:18:06]

wagnerrp:

before replacing your father's existing software

[15:18:22]

sphery:

Finished? We have so much more to do. I will admit that it's Finnished, but only thanks to the hard work of some Scandinavian translators.

[15:18:25]

** justinh smacks dustybin for good measure **

[15:18:29]

dustybin:

wagnerrp: it took me 3 years to learn mythtv, and i still dont know it all

[15:18:47]

iamlindoro:

s/it all/much at all/

[15:18:52]

wagnerrp:

theres a big difference between knowing everything, and being comfortable

[15:19:12]

justinh:

I still find bits out every now & then – and I've been using mythtv for about 5 years now :)

[15:19:22]

wagnerrp:

ditto

[15:19:23]

justinh:

but then it's not stayed still for all that time

[15:19:37]

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[15:19:55]

Little_Ted:

cool. I will experiement on some old hardware with mythbuntu, thanks for all the help guys

[15:20:00]

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[15:20:42]

sphery:

slipcon: got some time to work through identifying the bad data?

[15:20:54]

slipcon:

sure, lets give it a try.

[15:21:16]

sphery:

OK, going into the PM to keep all the discussion from flooding the channel

[15:21:58]

j-rod:

I'm liking this change I finally got around to making function in the rpm fusion mythtv packages...

[15:21:59]

j-rod:

2010-03–09 14:21:20.482 mythfrontend version: trunk [0.23–0.1.svn.r23702.fc12 (r23702)] www.mythtv.org

[15:22:01]

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[15:22:34]

j-rod:

way better than 'trunk [exported]'

[15:24:07]

j-rod:

iamlindoro: XMLParseBase, Error: Unknown widget type. loading Arclight. recognize that?

[15:24:44]

j-rod:

location Arclight/base.xml @ 1609, Name: '' Type: 'multiline'

[15:24:54]

iamlindoro:

j-rod: That's just a warning

[15:25:07]

iamlindoro:

it's there because I've themed a multiline textedit even though they don't exist yet

[15:25:19]

j-rod:

aha

[15:25:28]

iamlindoro:

if gbee implements them as I expect him to, they'll work without effort :)

[15:25:49]

j-rod:

I rarely ever actually look at the cli output of the frontend loading, but I'm reloading it remotely from within screen, so... :)

[15:26:20]

iamlindoro:

Yeah, just knew I wanted some multiline edit widgets even though there isn't one yet

[15:26:31]

iamlindoro:

so I put them in even though they only function as single-line at the moment

[15:27:23]

j-rod:

worksforme

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[15:50:58]

sphery:

j-rod: thank you... I was /really/ hoping that you guys would get the revision into your packages.

[15:51:52]

j-rod:

sphery: I thought I'd fixed it so that it was some time back, but that apparently stopped working at some point w/o me noticing (assuming it actually worked to begin with)

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j-rod:

this route should be fairly future-proof, since its implemented by a patch to the source that won't apply if the code that generates that info changes :)

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[15:53:17]

j-rod:

well, a patch, and something in the spec that sed's the rpm Version and Release info into the generated c file

[15:53:50]

sphery:

cool

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toxster:

hello, im having problems watching and recording at the same time on my dual dvb-s2 setup, i have setup 2 capture cards, 1 video source, 2 inpuit connector mapping, but when i check on mythweb, it says is has 5 encoders?

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AndyCap:

toxster: 4 would be normal, 2 tuners with 2 virtual tuners each

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sphery:

iamlindoro: There, I opened a new ticket just before the release, but at least I closed an existing one as a dup #7513 (of the one I created :). So, at least I'm not slowing things.

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dustybin:

hows this for dedication, i just created these :D

[17:17:11]

dustybin:

http://img191.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20100309at211.png/

[17:18:07]

justinh:

wow

[17:18:28]

justinh:

again, irc lacking a sarcasm tag really spoils the moment though

[17:20:04]

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[17:21:46]

justinh:

in other news, my first attempt at fixing a laptop has failed. think the cmos battery might be a dud but it's soldered to the board

[17:22:09]

justinh:

least I didn't have any bits left over when I reassembled it though. I binned the leftovers :P

[17:22:16]

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[17:22:17]

wagnerrp:

soldered to the board? ive never seen such a thing

[17:22:47]

wagnerrp:

or you mean it had wires coming out that were soldered to the board?

[17:23:09]

justinh:

no, soldered to the board

[17:24:05]

justinh:

must be a rechargeable dealy of some kind

[17:24:44]

justinh:

might not even be that, it just completely fails to boot. powers up now though, which is more than it was doing before

[17:27:17]

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[17:31:54]

mzb:

anyone got experience with using LED lights?

[17:32:13]

justinh:

as in light fittings using LEDs?

[17:32:21]

justinh:

as in domestic light fittings?

[17:32:41]

mzb:

any method using LED

[17:32:58]

kormoc:

Yes, they produce light

[17:33:18]

wagnerrp:

only in one direction

[17:33:35]

kormoc:

until it hits the disco ball!

[17:33:36]

wagnerrp:

turn them the other direction and... theyre... completely... black

[17:33:37]

** kormoc groves **

[17:33:46]

kormoc:

*grooves

[17:33:58]

mzb:

oh dear ... drinking time in the UK ;)

[17:34:13]

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[17:34:30]

mzb:

I started thinking about a whole heap of LED's (think 'fairy net') running on a PWM supply

[17:34:31]

kormoc:

too bad I'm not in the uk

[17:34:36]

mzb:

:)

[17:34:49]

mzb:

at least you're drinking then? ;))

[17:34:53]

justinh:

you still need to current limit, pretty much

[17:34:57]

kormoc:

sadly, that's a negative as well

[17:35:15]

mzb:

ah, just a sensational sense of humour for this time of the day then :)

[17:35:22]

justinh:

though it gets complicated if you think in terms of short pulses :)

[17:35:26]

mzb:

then I started to think of ultra-brights

[17:35:43]

kormoc:

end goal being?

[17:35:45]

justinh:

see $internet for inventive ways of driving LEDs :)

[17:35:48]

mzb:

I've already got PWM, and I'm more than capable of making a supply

[17:35:48]

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[17:35:50]

mag0o:

ultra-bright LED's!!!

[17:36:04]

mzb:

goal is to light the computer room I'm building

[17:36:28]

mzb:

I don't want to use fluoros (besides I've run out) or incandescents

[17:36:40]

mag0o:

buy an alarm clock with a blue face, it keeps my daughters room lit, even at night

[17:36:53]

kormoc:

you know, there are already leds in bulb shapes with all the required hardware

[17:37:03]

justinh:

yup

[17:37:09]

mzb:

hehe ... I want a _range_ of brightness

[17:37:13]

mzb:

yep

[17:37:19]

justinh:

even driver modules which do all the work for you via DMX :)

[17:37:33]

kormoc:

mzb: http://www.theledlight.com/A19-led-bulb.html

[17:37:34]

mzb:

so I saw some 10mm white in the range of 150k-290k mcd

[17:37:42]

justinh:

no messing about with home-brew PWM junk :)

[17:37:50]

mzb:

20–35 degree spread

[17:38:03]

mzb:

justinh: I _will_ be using my own PWM

[17:38:13]

mzb:

and I will be using my own supply

[17:38:21]

kormoc:

seems extremely silly to me

[17:38:22]

** kormoc shrugs **

[17:38:29]

mzb:

what does?

[17:38:37]

justinh:

well, it's your time I guess

[17:38:42]

mzb:

I already have the PWM (arduino)

[17:38:48]

kormoc:

building it all vs purchasing them predone and professional quality

[17:39:09]

mzb:

ok, it's my time and that's how I choose to spend it

[17:39:22]

kormoc:

doesn't mean I don't find it silly :P

[17:39:47]

mzb:

it also means there's a possibility (if I keep the costs down) that a) I can afford to upgrade the MBE and b) buy a POOL TABLE!

[17:40:01]

** kormoc blinks **

[17:40:03]

mzb:

I don't care how much time it takes

[17:40:11]

kormoc:

pool tables cost under a hundred or two?

[17:40:18]

mzb:

:)

[17:40:22]

kormoc:

(I guess it depends on how many lights you want...)

[17:40:40]

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[17:40:57]

mzb:

the budget is tight ... if I go to close to "budget" there won't be enough left over for the other luxuries

[17:41:04]

justinh:

there's those who use a sledgehammer to crack a nut, then there are those who mine metal ore, build a furnace & smelt their own materials & cast their own sledgehammer.. not to mention growing their own nuts

[17:41:26]

mzb:

yes, I'm the latter

[17:41:45]

mzb:

keeping in mind this is how I _like_ to spend my time

[17:42:17]

mzb:

building stuff that makes my life more enjoyable _is_ enjoyable ... get it?

[17:42:19]

justinh:

maybe a better one for #electronics :)

[17:42:56]

kormoc:

mzb: sure, I get it, doesn't mean I don't find this project silly :P

[17:43:26]

mzb:

*sigh* ... just figured someone here would have used LEDs of some sort for backlight and/or illumination in their mythtv entertainment room

[17:43:38]

mzb:

kormoc: nm, some people never get it

[17:43:44]

kormoc:

Sure, I bought pre-done led light bulbs and used them :P

[17:44:12]

justinh:

mzb: not many have your level of umm... dedication ;-)

[17:44:25]

mzb:

hehe nicely put

[17:44:57]

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[17:45:05]

mzb:

kormoc: how many watts, are they individual LED's or multiple, what spread do they have, how many have you used in a single room?

[17:45:26]

toxster:

hi again, i cant seem to get my 2 dvb-s cards working, when i start a recording, i cannot swith to another channels thats not in the same mux

[17:45:26]

justinh:

but if you're gonna drive a lot, I'd recommend you use series/parallel combinations & pwm switch the power *and* current limit it

[17:45:40]

kormoc:

mzb: I have a pair of these: http://www.theledlight.com/EO-PAR30L.html in daylight white

[17:45:52]

toxster:

must be a noob mistake by me :(

[17:46:00]

mzb:

justinh: I'm using an Arduino that I won on Sparkfun's Free Day

[17:46:03]

mzb:

.

[17:46:51]

justinh:

mzb: and use a sensible supply voltage.. and then careful with the switcher.. FETs have a habit of failing & being a PITA if they're even close to their rated spec

[17:46:52]

toxster:

i cannot switch inputs, and i can only browse the channels thats on the same transponder

[17:47:06]

toxster:

i have 2 different cards setup, any ideas?

[17:47:09]

mzb:

thanks kormoc ... that gets me a step closer

[17:47:15]

mzb:

two in the same room?

[17:47:20]

kormoc:

Yes

[17:47:25]

mzb:

6 x 1.5W in ea ... hmm

[17:48:03]

justinh:

kormoc: you using phase dimming with those?

[17:48:13]

kormoc:

to be fair, I'd likely want another two in the room for real usage

[17:48:32]

kormoc:

justinh: standard on-off, just happens to have been the brightest ones I could find at the time

[17:48:34]

mzb:

room I want to light is (will be) approx 2.4mx2.2m

[17:48:42]

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[17:48:49]

toxster:

noone here uses 2x cards on with the same subscription/reception technology (in my case dvb-s2)

[17:48:53]

kormoc:

bout the same size, a little smaller I'd think

[17:49:03]

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[17:49:05]

kormoc:

(your's is smaller that is)

[17:49:47]

justinh:

ahhh dimmable by interrupting the power? Blech

[17:49:56]

toxster:

DVBChan(5:/dev/dvb/adapter3/frontend0) Error: SetChannelByString(233): Multiplex is not available

[17:50:03]

mzb:

so I figured a few of these: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem . . . 370344712041

[17:50:15]

mzb:

but I read that multiple LEDs not as good

[17:50:37]

kormoc:

you're not gonna get a lot of light out of one

[17:50:47]

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[17:51:04]

justinh:

they should be shot for using comic sans

[17:51:52]

mzb:

so I started to look at ones like these: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem . . . 320499047993

[17:51:55]

mzb:

(and brethren)

[17:52:07]

mzb:

ie: the high(er) wattage ones

[17:52:58]

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[17:53:54]

mzb:

the hacker in me wants to get these: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem . . . 170451983746

[17:54:04]

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[17:54:26]

justinh:

blimey. 1W MR16 LED bulb for £0.99 each

[17:55:16]

AndyCap:

mzb: building fnordlichts?

[17:55:30]

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[17:56:11]

justinh:

mzb: making your own would be tricky, heatsinking issues ;)

[17:56:49]

mzb:

AndyCap: it had occurred to me, but I just want dimmable LED to light a small room

[17:56:51]

justinh:

they do actually get warm.. just not as warm as incandescents

[17:57:20]

justinh:

heh the service manual for that laptop says swap the main board. really helpful

[17:57:43]

mzb:

justinh: I've got (/making) a false ceiling with fan ventilation, and I've got heaps of aluminium so I don't see heatsinking as an issue

[17:58:20]

justinh:

yeh but making your own & not have them look like ass could be tricky

[17:58:31]

mzb:

hehe

[17:58:43]

justinh:

unless you have a milling machine...

[17:59:04]

mzb:

no, that's still on the list ... got all the bits though! ;)

[17:59:09]

mzb:

fwiw, the last (time-wasting) project didn't go over budget, looks ok, and does it's job

[17:59:14]

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[17:59:38]

AndyCap:

suddenly im reminded of that plastic ceiling thing

[17:59:39]

mzb:

http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/Smoker/ . . . FULL-RES.jpg

[17:59:55]

mzb:

already sounds expensive ;)

[18:00:22]

mzb:

http://www.users.on.net/~marcusbrutus/Smoker/ . . . 03_2.5hr.jpg

[18:00:42]

mzb:

just for perpective, that's a 2.3kg chicken

[18:00:47]

mzb:

s/perspective

[18:01:10]

kormoc:

and here I used a hotplate, terra cotta pot and some wood chips...

[18:02:07]

mzb:

I want to be able to cook in the rain and keep the dog away from my food as it cooks ;P

[18:02:51]

AndyCap:

Ah, Barrisol! Too far from my notion of what a roof should be to even consider. :P http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqwUF6oMOOA

[18:03:10]

mzb:

(and be able to do a LARGE amount of food)

[18:03:18]

AndyCap:

s/roof/ceiling/

[18:03:47]

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[18:09:02]

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[18:09:53]

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[18:10:02]

ThisOtherGuy:

hi all!

[18:10:16]

kormoc:

Hello Dr. ThisOtherGuy

[18:10:49]

ThisOtherGuy:

Hiya Ev'ry-bohdy!

[18:11:51]

ThisOtherGuy:

Can anyone help me with a MythWeb issue?

[18:11:55]

** justinh wonders what happened to Dr Marvin Monroe **

[18:12:11]

justinh:

ThisOtherGuy: people can only help when they know what's up

[18:12:38]

AndyCap:

justinh: dead?

[18:13:17]

ThisOtherGuy:

k – I'm using trunk and I noticed that preview images don't appear on the Recorded Programs page for recent recordings. I see these errors in the backend log: http://pastebin.com/bMd6T3jd

[18:13:36]

kormoc:

svn up

[18:14:00]

kormoc:

I think I fixed that last night

[18:14:07]

kormoc:

or perhaps I broke it last night, one of the two

[18:14:08]

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[18:14:29]

ThisOtherGuy:

kormoc: I just svn up'd a few minutes before posting, but it's been happening for me for the past few days

[18:14:35]

kormoc:

hrm

[18:14:52]

ThisOtherGuy:

since March 4th

[18:15:28]

kormoc:

didja update the backend on march 4th?

[18:16:07]

ThisOtherGuy:

yes

[18:16:12]

kormoc:

hrm

[18:16:24]

kormoc:

I wonder if I missed an important change...

[18:16:38]

** kormoc eyes the encyclopedia named sphery **

[18:16:59]

kormoc:

ThisOtherGuy: know the previous working backend you had?

[18:17:05]

kormoc:

(date/revision?)

[18:17:09]

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[18:17:09]

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[18:17:28]

** ThisOtherGuy checking logs **

[18:17:56]

ThisOtherGuy:

mythbackend version: trunk [23668M] www.mythtv.org

[18:18:20]

kormoc:

kk, that narrows it down a bit, I'll check the logs and see if I can find what changed

[18:18:26]

sphery:

kormoc: I've seen someone else mention a similar issue, but I don't know of changes that would cause it (other than danielk's changes to the programinfo passing--but if it's that, it's not a MythWeb bug)

[18:18:48]

sphery:

ThisOtherGuy: r23668 worked?

[18:18:51]

ThisOtherGuy:

no

[18:18:53]

sphery:

if so, it's not danielk's changes

[18:19:00]

ThisOtherGuy:

23668 is when it started not working

[18:19:02]

kormoc:

ooh

[18:19:09]

kormoc:

know the previous working point?

[18:19:11]

sphery:

do you know what you had before that one?

[18:19:18]

** ThisOtherGuy checking logs **

[18:20:36]

ThisOtherGuy:

23566M

[18:20:43]

iamlindoro:

There is a ticket on the no preview image thing

[18:21:02]

sphery:

http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8118

[18:21:30]

sphery:

which says 23645 didn't work

[18:21:46]

sphery:

And – why can't it seem to remember the pathnames?

[18:21:58]

kormoc:

huh

[18:22:03]

sphery:

quoting the ticket

[18:22:25]

kormoc:

oh lord, nice

[18:22:59]

sphery:

kormoc: danielk's changes had to do with not updating the paths in programinfo in some cases

[18:23:44]

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[18:23:57]

sphery:

kormoc: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/23599

[18:24:18]

sphery:

"But it also removes some of the cruft in the PreviewGenerator? constructor that had built up to deal with places that called the preview generator without setting pathname as per the PreviewGenerator? documentation."

[18:24:27]

sphery:

perhaps MythWeb is in violation? :)

[18:24:42]

kormoc:

yup!

[18:24:45]

sphery:

didn't you read the documentation? sheesh!

[18:24:48]

** kormoc laughs **

[18:26:43]

sphery:

btw, I close http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/7513#comment:7 (the one you changed to infoneeded_new last night) as I am 99.99999% positive it's what I just reported in http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/8158 (the 2nd--no DB/invalid DB connection info--case)

[18:27:06]

kormoc:

snaz

[18:27:16]

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[18:27:53]

sphery:

figured it was easier than trying to change his ticket to have the pertinent info

[18:28:37]

sphery:

oh, and thanks for the pre-ticket info you gave me--it allowed me to sound like I knew what I was talking about in the ticket description

[18:29:09]

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[18:29:32]

kormoc:

:)

[18:31:47]

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[18:34:21]

kd3:

blah. lirc_zilog's not finding my hvr-1600

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[19:52:29]

RDV_Linux:

For anyone that is interested iamlindoro is testing a new (unreleased) MythNetvision utility that will add many new grabbers. Here is a short video of a TOS compliant Hulu search: http://www.fecitfacta.com/hulu.ogg

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[20:18:06]

sphery:

RDV_Linux: I completely agree with your conclusion that EMML/Mashups are the way to go. Now we just need to make a C++/Qt implementation of an EMML runtime (mythmashup :) to make it really easy for users.

[20:18:14]

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[20:19:10]

RDV_Linux:

sphery: Do not under estimate the complexity in creating an EMML mashup script.

[20:19:24]

** sphery wonders if we could get dblain interested in doing that... **

[20:19:43]

sphery:

Yeah, figuring it's not trivial since it seems that the reference implementation is pretty much the only one out there.

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[20:20:04]

iamlindoro:

RDV_Linux, note he's talking about a Qt EMML runtime

[20:20:14]

iamlindoro:

meaning removing the need for Tomcat/etc.

[20:20:58]

sphery:

we have to get cdev (dblain) off his UPnP and MythXML kick and get him sidetracked with EMML

[20:22:47]

RDV_Linux:

Have I become redundant this quickly;) Heck the thing is not even in alpha yet;)

[20:23:04]

sphery:

no, you're welcome to write it yourself

[20:23:04]

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[20:23:21]

sphery:

just figured that it would be easier to get someone else to do it :)

[20:25:30]

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[20:25:53]

danielqb:

hello

[20:25:59]

sphery:

hello

[20:26:11]

danielqb:

# of port to configure ZoneMinder???

[20:26:26]

iamlindoro:

sentence fragment give answer immediate!

[20:26:27]

danielqb:

sorry Hello

[20:26:30]

sphery:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/MythZoneMinder

[20:26:33]

sphery:

perhaps?

[20:26:43]

sphery:

btw, didn't MZM die?

[20:27:07]

sphery:

(i.e. get removed in the 0.23 development effort)

[20:27:16]

danielqb:

n in this not tellme the # port, he say the default port is 6548

[20:27:21]

sphery:

maybe not

[20:27:27]

danielqb:

!!!!!

[20:27:37]

sphery:

I still have --disable-mythzoneminder in my build commands

[20:27:52]

sphery:

so it must still exist

[20:28:06]

iamlindoro:

danielqb, The port is whatever port you have Zoneminder running on

[20:28:19]

iamlindoro:

presumably that defaults to 6548. If your setup is exotic or differs, then you will need to figure it out

[20:28:24]

danielqb:

mmm, but ZM is the web service

[20:28:28]

sphery:

and the MythZMServer port default is 6548 but can be changed

[20:29:07]

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[20:29:11]

danielqb:

yea, i look the options on my ZM and not found this

[20:29:33]

iamlindoro:

please read the above wiki page

[20:29:35]

iamlindoro:

" Running MythZMServer

[20:29:36]

iamlindoro:

You should usually start mythzmserver as a service at boot time. It must be started after the ZoneMinder server has been started. One way to do this is to modify the ZM startup script to also start/stop mythzmserver. The server should be run as either root or as the same user that ZM uses. By default the server will listen on port 6548 and will read the ZM config from /etc/zm.conf if you need to change any of these you can add a param

[20:29:36]

iamlindoro:

eter to change them. See the README in the mythzmserver source directory for a list of available parameters. "

[20:29:54]

sphery:

danielqb: in mythfrontend, go to the setup for MythZoneMinder, then find the setting: "Port the server runs on: Unless you've got good reason to, don't change this."

[20:30:06]

sphery:

defaults to 6548

[20:30:22]

sphery:

and make sure you don't have firewalls blocking it

[20:30:44]

** iamlindoro points sphery at the above too ;) **

[20:30:51]

sphery:

yeah

[20:30:59]

iamlindoro:

look carefully at the name of the program being run

[20:31:00]

iamlindoro:

:)

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[20:39:08]

jams:

well after about an hour of troubleshooting why the picture jumps and is blocky I have concluded that time warner is the program

[20:39:26]

jams:

watching the analog channels on a analog tv shows the same problem..so it must be their signal

[20:39:42]

jams:

and their support line is busy..so i suspsect others are having the same trouble

[20:40:04]

sphery:

heh

[20:40:11]

sphery:

gotta love cable

[20:40:46]

jams:

yeah..it really looked like mysql was the problem, just the way everything was so blockly and stuttering

[20:40:53]

sphery:

and yet their primary commercial push is "And without all those drop-outs/signal issues you get with satellite."

[20:41:29]

jams:

yep

[20:41:31]

sphery:

our cable co (Brighthouse, formerly TWC) has significantly more signal issues than satellite services did when I used Dish

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[20:42:05]

sphery:

our = my area (I use OTA)

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[20:52:23]

skd5aner:

great – got a notice in the mail that TWC is going to reorder their ENTIRE lineup above 100 :P

[20:53:05]

skd5aner:

This should be fun :'(

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[21:05:29]

jams:

skd5aner- they did that here already about 5 months ago. schedules direct created a brand new lineup, so I all had todo was switch line ups and it worked

[21:05:46]

jams:

correct a few recording schedules but for the most part it was simple

[21:12:21]

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[21:13:12]

Beirdo:

ahoy there... from Seattle :)

[21:13:44]

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[21:15:41]

iamlindoro:

Welcome to our time zone

[21:16:02]

Beirdo:

hehe

[21:16:12]

Beirdo:

my body thinks its 9pm

[21:16:28]

iamlindoro:

That means you get to wait until midnight your time to watch LOST :)

[21:16:34]

Beirdo:

gonna go hunt me some food shortly

[21:17:00]

wagnerrp:

isnt that why he installed mythtv?

[21:17:03]

iamlindoro:

I think I mention this once per month or so, but... I would so pay a few extra bucks a month for an east coast feed of all my shows

[21:17:10]

iamlindoro:

I can't wait for lost, personally :)

[21:17:35]

iamlindoro:

(that is to say, I can't stand to timeshift it, I end up watching it semi-live)

[21:17:53]

Beirdo:

hehe

[21:18:02]

wagnerrp:

iamlindoro: actually... hes one more past that

[21:18:03]

wagnerrp:

1AM

[21:18:34]

iamlindoro:

ah, yeah

[21:19:41]

wagnerrp:

or does it air at 8PM over there? (it airs at 9PM here)

[21:20:05]

wagnerrp:

oh you evil evil time zones

[21:20:50]

Beirdo:

I dunno, I don't get crap at where I'm staying in PR

[21:21:03]

Beirdo:

our house, sure, but I'm only there on the weekends

[21:21:14]

Beirdo:

as the 1.5h daily commute was killing me

[21:21:57]

Beirdo:

staying in the empty half of my mother-in-law's house.. no cable unless I pay. bleh :)

[21:22:00]

wagnerrp:

one side of the island to the other?

[21:22:06]

Beirdo:

nearly

[21:22:16]

Beirdo:

Dorado to Isabela

[21:23:55]

wagnerrp:

imdb gets data from TMS?

[21:27:59]

Beirdo:

wouldn't surprise me

[21:29:26]

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[21:35:25]

ThisOtherGuy:

RDV_Linux: I like how the update manager pops up at the end of that video – that thing always pops up at the wrong time

[21:35:53]

** iamlindoro notes the update manager was alt-tabbed to **

[21:36:30]

RDV_Linux:

That was all iamlindoro's doing. I only take credit for the new grabber;)

[21:43:25]

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[21:46:04]

jaypetey:

I have a python script that I wrote that I intend to use as a user job. The script works perfectly when run from the terminal, but when run from a user job it exits extremely early (no errors, but the script doesn't really run either). Does anyone know any tricks to make custom user jobs work?

[21:48:05]

wagnerrp:

http://mythtv.org/wiki/Python_bindings/Data_Objects#Job

[21:48:38]

wagnerrp:

if you give me 15 minutes, ill fill out the documentation on that a bit more

[21:49:03]

jaypetey:

wagnerrp, thanks. i'll look into it too

[21:49:31]

wagnerrp:

(this is assuming youre running trunk

[21:49:49]

wagnerrp:

if not, youve got a couple weeks before this stuff gets into the release version

[21:50:20]

jaypetey:

yeah, i'm running whatever it is mythbuntu gives me

[21:51:08]

wagnerrp:

how are you currently calling it?

[21:51:32]

jaypetey:

calling mythtv? or calling my script?

[21:51:43]

wagnerrp:

how is mythtv calling your script

[21:52:34]

jaypetey:

user job #1 (as setup by backend setup program), calling: /home/joe/script.py %CHANID% %STARTTIME%

[21:52:53]

wagnerrp:

and when you run that manually, things work?

[21:53:03]

jaypetey:

perfectly

[21:53:07]

wagnerrp:

are you sure youre giving it the same chanid and starttime that the script expects?

[21:53:15]

wagnerrp:

youve got two separate times

[21:53:25]

wagnerrp:

the scheduled time of the program

[21:53:30]

wagnerrp:

and the actual time of the recording

[21:53:44]

jaypetey:

hmm, which one is the one used in the filenames?

[21:53:47]

wagnerrp:

if you have a recording start offset, these will differ

[21:54:09]

jaypetey:

oh, i don't have offset

[21:54:35]

wagnerrp:

it would be better if you didnt combine them like that if possible

[21:54:54]

wagnerrp:

use the chanid and starttime to look up the recording in the database, use the entry in the database to look up the file basename

[21:55:12]

jaypetey:

not combined, they're two different argument variables

[21:55:27]

wagnerrp:

i realize that

[21:55:33]

jaypetey:

i do use them to lookup the filename in the database...

[21:55:44]

wagnerrp:

oh

[21:56:09]

wagnerrp:

when you asked which one was used in the filename, i thought you meant you were just accessing 'chanid_starttime.mpg'

[21:56:33]

wagnerrp:

you should be able to look into your backend logs and get the traceback from the job

[21:56:34]

jaypetey:

no, i was asking that because i look at the filename to determine the argv's when calling from terminal

[21:57:19]

k-man:

any idea if mythfrontend can play back HD content on a mac mini 1.8Ghz core 2 duo under OSX (not linux)?

[21:57:27]

k-man:

ie, has enough grunt to

[21:57:40]

wagnerrp:

ambiguous question

[21:57:52]

wagnerrp:

what is 'HD content'

[21:58:06]

k-man:

wagnerrp: 1080p content in Australia, DVB-T

[21:58:15]

jaypetey:

so, for the file "1021_20100309180000.mpg i would call the script as: /home/joe/script.py 1021 20100309180000

[21:58:18]

wagnerrp:

still need more... mpeg2 or h264?

[21:58:26]

k-man:

wagnerrp: let me check hang on

[21:58:33]

wagnerrp:

jaypetey: that looks right

[21:59:06]

wagnerrp:

k-man: it should handle any mpeg2 you have just fine

[21:59:13]

jaypetey:

which would be the same as calling as a user job: /home/joe/script.py %CHANID% %STARTTIME% correct?

[21:59:22]

wagnerrp:

h264, it would depend on whether its multi-sliced, and what bitrate

[21:59:26]

wagnerrp:

but youre probably fine there too

[21:59:37]

wagnerrp:

jaypetey: it should, yes

[22:00:00]

k-man:

wagnerrp: you got me there, i have no idea the exact format that is transmitted in Aus, but i do recall hearing that no broadcaster is transmitting above 720p at the moment

[22:00:02]

jaypetey:

means my troubles are deeper... do you know where the backend logs are stored on mythbuntu?

[22:00:06]

wagnerrp:

to be honest, every time ive done that, ive just handed off the jobid, and pulled the chanid and starttime from the database

[22:00:08]

k-man:

but i could be wrong on that count too

[22:00:16]

wagnerrp:

maybe /var/log/mythtv/mythbackend.log

[22:00:31]

jaypetey:

k-man, if you're not transcoding it (or using mythtv's built in transcoder) then it's mpeg2

[22:00:33]

wagnerrp:

720p is also ambiguous

[22:00:41]

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[22:00:58]

wagnerrp:

resolution, codec, and possibly entropy coding are what matters most

[22:01:13]

wagnerrp:

and in the AU, it could be mpeg2 or h264

[22:01:35]

k-man:

wagnerrp: ok – im searching google for something more specific – still looking

[22:02:07]

wagnerrp:

k-man: ffmpeg -i recording_file

[22:02:13]

iamlindoro:

For reference, nobody in australia is broadcasting 1080p

[22:02:18]

k-man:

wagnerrp: not at home right now – so i cant

[22:02:31]

iamlindoro:

1080i, sure... 1080p, nuh-uh

[22:02:59]

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[22:02:59]

wagnerrp:

s/resolution/bitrate/

[22:06:39]

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[22:07:48]

k-man:

wagnerrp: according to wikipedia, in aus, they use mpeg-2 and H.264

[22:08:02]

k-man:

wagnerrp: still looking for info on resolution and bitrate

[22:08:22]

iamlindoro:

those won't be things you can look up

[22:08:27]

iamlindoro:

you'll need access to the file itself

[22:08:28]

wagnerrp:

not resolution, i misspoke... just bitrate

[22:08:36]

wagnerrp:

you cant ssh into your machine?

[22:08:36]

k-man:

oh

[22:08:37]

k-man:

ok

[22:08:44]

k-man:

wagnerrp: no, its switched off currently

[22:08:54]

k-man:

wagnerrp: just moved house and haven't fully set up yet

[22:09:05]

k-man:

ill check later

[22:12:16]

iamlindoro:

Re: [mythtv-commits] Ticket #7439: Created DVD truncated length

[22:12:16]

iamlindoro:

sigh

[22:13:06]

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[22:13:31]

k-man:

anyway, thanks for your help wagnerrp

[22:14:25]

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[22:15:08]

jaypetey:

wagnerrp, thanks from me too. i think i might have found my problem.

[22:15:59]

wagnerrp:

anyway, check out the python documentation on the wiki

[22:16:00]

k-man:

wagnerrp: i thought the machine was off, but my wife must have turned it on, bitrate 5909 kb/s mpeg2 720x576

[22:16:19]

k-man:

i usually record SD so not sure if thats an HD recording but i guess it is based on the resolution

[22:16:21]

wagnerrp:

the new versions should take the place of just about any direct sql calls you may have made

[22:16:23]

iamlindoro:

so 576i rather than 720p

[22:16:27]

iamlindoro:

ie, that recording is SD

[22:16:43]

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[22:16:58]

iamlindoro:

a mac mini should make short work of that

[22:17:02]

k-man:

ah, good point iamlindoro

[22:17:09]

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[22:18:19]

iamlindoro:

if your mac mini has nvidia graphics, it shoudl handle any broadcast media in Aus

[22:18:56]

k-man:

iamlindoro: ok – actually, im going to get an older one because they can output to svideo

[22:19:02]

k-man:

until i get an HD capable tv

[22:19:10]

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[22:19:42]

iamlindoro:

even without nVidia graphics, that system should be okay with just about any MPEG-2 content you throw at it-- H.264 of some bitrates and encodings may give it a bit of trouble

[22:20:14]

k-man:

i plan to run it under osx though

[22:20:15]

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[22:20:17]

k-man:

so i can use itunes

[22:20:37]

k-man:

oh – which is irrelevant to your statemnt. sorry

[22:20:41]

iamlindoro:

all bets off under OS X

[22:20:52]

iamlindoro:

should still be mostly okay with MPEG-2 and some H.264... just can't promise

[22:21:22]

k-man:

ok, no worries

[22:21:33]

k-man:

thanks for your input iamlindoro and wagnerrp

[22:21:38]

iamlindoro:

np

[22:22:16]

k-man:

i just have to find a solution to get the backing/frontend out of the living room. i can't stand listening to the fans and hard drives any more

[22:22:19]

k-man:

its driving me nuts

[22:22:43]

iamlindoro:

for the cost of even a used mini, you could buy an nVidia ION, put linux on it, and play just about anything

[22:22:51]

iamlindoro:

and it'd be tiny and quiet

[22:23:09]

k-man:

except you can't run itunes on that

[22:23:28]

iamlindoro:

sure, but itunes on a TV system isn't a great experience either

[22:23:40]

iamlindoro:

alternatively, dual boot the ION and run iTunes

[22:23:47]

k-man:

true – but i can use the osx remote desktop app

[22:23:53]

k-man:

no, dual booting is fail

[22:24:15]

k-man:

imho

[22:24:21]

iamlindoro:

you're right, dual boot much less friendly than having to run remote desktop to play your music

[22:24:24]

iamlindoro:

;)

[22:24:36]

k-man:

:)

[22:24:51]

k-man:

no... also there is the iphone itunes remote app which is cool too

[22:24:54]

iamlindoro:

anyway, most here would argue iTunes sucks/is fail./whatever

[22:25:24]

k-man:

iamlindoro: perhaps, but i want to try this route – i have been using myth music for years and to be honest it is just too difficult

[22:26:06]

k-man:

at least for me anyway

[22:26:22]

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[22:26:28]

k-man:

i have a friend who has done it that way and he swears by it – but he does have an HDTV

[22:27:24]

tzanger:

k-man: tried minimyth?

[22:28:09]

k-man:

tzanger: no, whats that?

[22:28:24]

tzanger:

diskless mythtv frontend distro

[22:28:28]

tzanger:

I use it, works great

[22:28:31]

k-man:

cool

[22:28:34]

tzanger:

mythmusic, mythvideo, mythdvd, etc all in there

[22:28:43]

iamlindoro:

s/mythdvd//

[22:28:49]

iamlindoro:

(since it doesn't exist any more)

[22:28:51]

k-man:

how do you find mythmusic? personally i find it difficult to use

[22:29:25]

iamlindoro:

mythmusic is getting rewritten from scratch for .24 FWIW

[22:29:32]

tzanger:

it's not great, no, but it works great fo rme for streaming some nice relaxing music when the wife and I want to enjoy a glass of wine or something

[22:29:50]

k-man:

iamlindoro: thats interesting to know, thanks for the update

[22:31:25]

k-man:

iamlindoro: i saw a long thread about myth music on the mailing lists – maybe that was the precursor to this rewrite?

[22:34:34]

iamlindoro:

It was an ill-advised opening of the rewrite to UI ideas

[22:34:47]

iamlindoro:

so instead of what we asked for, we got four thousand feature requests

[22:34:59]

iamlindoro:

few having anything to do with the UI

[22:35:17]

k-man:

hehe

[22:35:24]

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[22:36:10]

k-man:

iamlindoro: i have often thought about the challenge of managing music, even considered writing something myselfe once but I came to the conclusion that it is a very difficult problem in fact

[22:36:44]

k-man:

of all the programs that try and do it, itunes is the _least worst_ imho – and itunes still sucks imho

[22:37:06]

iamlindoro:

Impossible to please everyone, and every myth user you don't please is all too happy to get on the mailing lists, slashdot, and anywhere else to tell you how you personally are an a-hole for failing to make his dreams come true

[22:37:37]

k-man:

iamlindoro: yeah, that is a very sad aspect of mythtv. i fail to understand that attitude

[22:38:25]

iamlindoro:

Pretty much completely burned two very talented themers and guaranteed that they will never release another theme publicly

[22:38:37]

k-man:

iamlindoro: very very sad

[22:38:40]

iamlindoro:

yep :(

[22:39:05]

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[22:39:29]

k-man:

interesting to consider, do other large software projects suffer from a similar issue? like the kernel for instance?

[22:39:44]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:39:59]

Beirdo:

lusers wouldn't have a clue what to request in the kernel

[22:40:08]

Beirdo:

other than "support this crappy card"

[22:40:36]

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[22:41:56]

k-man:

yeah, i think that mythtv attracts less knowledgable users

[22:42:01]

Beirdo:

but yeah, the ingrates can mike life miserable

[22:42:14]

iamlindoro:

k-man, I have (I believe) worked hard to soften our image with users and increase dialog since becoming a myth dev (organized the theme contest, have done my best to clean up this channel, etc), but even I just can't follow the user list any more... it's way too caustic

[22:42:37]

k-man:

iamlindoro: interesting

[22:43:14]

k-man:

iamlindoro: as in you used to read the users list but not any more?

[22:43:15]

iamlindoro:

Why anyone feels that they can use downright cruel language about someone else's year-or-two worth of work and then expect that that person will want to listen to "suggestions" (which sometimes feel vaguely like emotional blackmail) is beyond me

[22:43:22]

Beirdo:

make (I am having typing issues)

[22:43:45]

Beirdo:

iamlindoro: it's the "I'm entitled to everything" syndrome

[22:43:54]

iamlindoro:

yeah, entitlement culture... it's sad

[22:43:54]

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[22:44:07]

k-man:

Beirdo: yeah, exactly – where does that come from?

[22:44:07]

Beirdo:

and aggravating to boot :)

[22:44:15]

Beirdo:

spoiled brats

[22:44:27]

iamlindoro:

wagnerrp has a cartoon that explains it

[22:44:28]

k-man:

gen y maybe?

[22:44:33]

k-man:

not that i know what gen you guys are

[22:44:40]

wagnerrp:

community means you must cater to the whims of everyone

[22:44:46]

iamlindoro:

more or less that anonymity and an audience makes normally reasonable people into <bannable word>

[22:44:51]

Beirdo:

k-man: likely so.

[22:45:00]

Beirdo:

jerks (to make it more polite)

[22:45:12]

wagnerrp:

this one? http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19

[22:45:20]

Beirdo:

that would be it

[22:45:20]

iamlindoro:

hehm yeah

[22:45:21]

iamlindoro:

er heh,

[22:46:16]

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[22:46:59]

Beirdo:

I mean, if you can't code, and can't make themes, then at least be *respectful* when you make "suggestions"

[22:47:11]

iamlindoro:

By way of example, the person who personally did 99% of the MythUI rewrite, including writing the library itself, for 18 straight months, did all that work AND wrote Terra... only to have people use appalling language about both the theme and discarding all the UI progress becasue they can't press right in the recordings list any more to get a menu

[22:47:38]

iamlindoro:

Needless to say, he's been mostly absent this release, and to me it's perfectly reasonable-- I'd need a break too

[22:47:47]

Beirdo:

yeah

[22:47:48]

k-man:

yeah

[22:48:02]

Beirdo:

Terra's not my fave, but it's nice, and a heck of a lot better than I can do :)

[22:48:04]

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[22:48:45]

jaypetey:

wagnerrp, how do i start using the stuff on that page you send me? (or more so, what do i need to import and to i need to install anything else first?)

[22:48:51]

iamlindoro:

And whereas before .22 he was ready to begin work on the MythMusic rewrite, it didn't happen this release because of all the hurt feelings/frustration/burnt out

[22:48:53]

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[22:48:53]

Beirdo:

and if ya don't like a certain theme, use another :)

[22:48:54]

jaypetey:

i had never seen that page before, but it looks awesome

[22:49:00]

iamlindoro:

yeah

[22:49:13]

wagnerrp:

jaypetey: you need to be running trunk

[22:49:18]

Beirdo:

and if you like NONE of them, suck it up and work with someone to create one

[22:49:25]

jaypetey:

wagnerrp, crap. oh well i guess

[22:49:41]

wagnerrp:

read http://mythtv.org/wiki/Python_bindings first

[22:49:51]

iamlindoro:

Beirdo, can't say we didn't offer lots of incentives this release, too :)

[22:50:06]

iamlindoro:

HD-PVRs, tuners, t-shirts, free listings for a year, etc.

[22:50:14]

Beirdo:

yeah

[22:50:20]

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[22:50:41]

k-man:

is there a oneliner to get the video resolution of all my mpg videos?

[22:50:44]

Beirdo:

I mean, sure maybe you're an "ideas guy".. work with someone instead of whining and moaning :)

[22:51:05]

[R]:

k-man: all of them

[22:51:05]

[R]:

?

[22:51:19]

sphery:

k-man: ffmpeg -i

[22:51:25]

sphery:

(one line per video)

[22:51:28]

jaypetey:

wagnerrp, will i be able to use any of this without trunk?

[22:51:28]

wagnerrp:

told him, hes not at home

[22:51:28]

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[22:51:36]

wagnerrp:

jaypetey: no

[22:51:50]

k-man:

wagnerrp: yeah, i sshed in – computer was on after all

[22:51:59]

sphery:

or: for file in *.mpg ; do ffmpeg -i $file ; done

[22:52:10]

wagnerrp:

jaypetey: http://mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Old_Python_Bindings

[22:52:12]

k-man:

sphery: yeah, something like that, thanks

[22:52:16]

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[22:52:59]

sphery:

k-man: with a | grep, you can have it just give you the res lines

[22:53:20]

jaypetey:

wagnerrp, that's awesome. thanks a ton

[22:53:22]

Beirdo:

iamlindoro: I keep getting reminded of a Culture Club song.

[22:53:33]

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[22:53:34]

Beirdo:

"The War Song"

[22:53:46]

iamlindoro:

Beirdo, heh, don't know that one, will have to use MNV to search for it :)

[22:53:56]

Beirdo:

...war is stupid... and people are stupid...

[22:53:57]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:54:07]

k-man:

sphery: yeah, thanks

[22:54:29]

Beirdo:

of course, now k-man likely knows what age-group I'm in :)

[22:54:59]

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[22:55:06]

iamlindoro:

Ha, Boy George looks especially freakish in the video I found

[22:55:24]

Beirdo:

didn't he/she ALWAYS look freakish though?

[22:55:24]

sphery:

k-man: for file in *.mpg ; do echo -n "$file:"; ffmpeg -i $file 2>&1 | grep 'Stream.*Video' ; done

[22:55:32]

Beirdo:

one truly confused person

[22:55:49]

k-man:

Beirdo: boy george?

[22:55:51]

iamlindoro:

Beirdo, http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/81/Culture_Club.jpg

[22:55:56]

Beirdo:

yeah

[22:55:56]

iamlindoro:

Looks nearly normal there!

[22:56:01]

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[22:56:11]

sphery:

Beirdo: Do you really want to hurt me?

[22:56:18]

Beirdo:

yes...

[22:56:20]

k-man:

hes a hare crishna now afaik

[22:56:21]

iamlindoro:

Beirdo, that is, if he were girl george

[22:56:22]

sphery:

heh

[22:56:25]

** Beirdo kicks Boy George **

[22:57:00]

Beirdo:

freak... but was a good singer in his day in spite of being a freak :)

[22:57:02]

** wagnerrp makes sphery cry **

[22:57:04]

sphery:

who wins in a fight? Boy George or Marilyn Manson?

[22:57:18]

Beirdo:

hehe

[22:57:23]

k-man:

mm, but mm wouldn't fight imho

[22:57:25]

iamlindoro:

I think Boy George would demolish MM

[22:57:41]

Beirdo:

neither. Nonads to kick

[22:57:45]

Beirdo:

no nads...

[22:57:50]

Beirdo:

stupid kybrd

[22:57:53]

k-man:

did you see MM in Bowling for Columbine – i was very impressed with his comments on those tragic events

[22:58:00]

sphery:

iamlindoro: Actually, it's Marilyn Manson--proof in The Time Machine (2002), as we saw he was the only person who survived 800,000 years into the future

[22:58:14]

Beirdo:

heh

[22:58:40]

wagnerrp:

wasnt boy george in one of the A-Team episodes?

[22:58:46]

Beirdo:

?!

[22:58:54]

Beirdo:

I don't recall that, but coulda been

[22:59:08]

Beirdo:

they were popular at the same time

[22:59:17]

sphery:

it's a recommended search on Google

[22:59:25]

wagnerrp:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0504160/

[22:59:52]

sphery:

there was a time when I would have thought that proof required actually seeing a shot of the episode, but now I'm lazy--just noting that Google recommends the search is proof

[23:00:29]

Beirdo:

heeheh

[23:01:09]

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[23:03:23]

sphery:

for those who wondered about my Time Machine reference, http://images.allmoviephoto.com/2002_The_Time . . . hine_015.jpg is the guy I meant (he's actually played by Jeremy Irons)

[23:04:19]

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[23:05:43]

kormoc:

sphery: looks half borg

[23:05:46]

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[23:06:09]

kormoc:

sphery: or rather looks half wraith (sg:a) and borg

[23:06:15]

sphery:

agreed

[23:06:21]

sphery:

he's Uber Morlock

[23:06:22]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, did you see: http://www.fecitfacta.com/hulu.ogg

[23:06:28]

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[23:06:32]

kormoc:

iamlindoro: I have not

[23:06:36]

** kormoc peers **

[23:06:39]

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[23:06:50]

iamlindoro:

kormoc, TOS-compliant

[23:07:05]

sphery:

kormoc: with that link he's providing that C++/Qt project you were looking for--implement an EMML runtime for MythTV

[23:07:32]

iamlindoro:

courtesy of RDV_Linux's new direction for MNV grabbers

[23:07:50]

sphery:

definitely the right direction

[23:07:56]

kormoc:

oh nice!

[23:08:05]

sphery:

but would be great not to have to use the EMML Runtime Reference Impl

[23:08:11]

iamlindoro:

Yeah

[23:08:35]

sphery:

(just because it's not as easy for a user to set up as would be some program that's part of Myth)

[23:08:38]

kormoc:

I'll totally need to get in on that action after I move

[23:08:48]

iamlindoro:

sphery is referring to some hoops to jump through to get set up (EMML engine running on tomcat) but since most people will be getting that done for them by packagers in a perfect world...

[23:08:49]

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[23:08:56]

kormoc:

ahh

[23:09:17]

sphery:

kormoc: which will be just in time for Hulu to start their subscription-only service

[23:09:17]

kormoc:

tomcat, a wonderful bane of existance

[23:09:35]

iamlindoro:

heh

[23:09:40]

sphery:

yeah, it's just that the EMML reference impl is too many pieces

[23:09:55]

iamlindoro:

well as a total newbie who knows nothing about it, following instructions I had it up in ~10 minutes

[23:10:04]

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[23:10:05]

sphery:

remember, iamlindoro , these are the same users who decide they don't want to run a WM because they don't want to waste resources on it

[23:10:14]

iamlindoro:

and if it's as easy for him to add grabbers to as he says (and given the first couple he's written) then it's well worth it

[23:10:20]

iamlindoro:

sphery, Their loss :)

[23:10:29]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: The EMML engine only needs a J2EE server but I used Tomcat as it worked and there was a Ubuntu package for it.

[23:10:46]

kormoc:

I honestly don't believe I'll be able to use it on my mini, I'm running way too close to the edge as is with comflagging

[23:10:47]

sphery:

Yeah, Tomcat is the best choice for it

[23:10:50]

wagnerrp:

sphery: and dont understand what to do when they have an error, 'your database is corrupt, please follow the instructions on this page...'

[23:11:09]

sphery:

wagnerrp: exactly... we should really fix that message... :)

[23:11:28]

** Beirdo yawns **

[23:11:58]

kormoc:

oh, EMML is just xml + xpath and xquery

[23:12:08]

sphery:

my biggest complaint is that you need a JDK, and you need Tomcat (and the network configuration to allow Tomcat to work), and you need it running in such a way that this frontend plugin can access it

[23:12:15]

kormoc:

we should be able to run that on any standard dom implementation if that's truly the case

[23:12:17]

Beirdo:

"your database is corrupt. Please reformat your hard drive and start over since that's doubtlessly what you will do anyways as you can't RT(fine)M"

[23:12:21]

iamlindoro:

sphery, change it to "it looks like your hypercode intranumeric oscillator may need calibration. I suggest trying to offset the secondary packet manipulator by 250usecs."

[23:12:22]

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[23:12:31]

sphery:

and when we have users with multiple frontends and backends and ... it becomes confusing

[23:12:35]

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[23:12:36]

iamlindoro:

(http://mythtv.org/pipermail/mythtv-commits/20 . . . 064142.html)

[23:12:40]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: Well the EMML engine also incorporates javascript (Rhino) and Java libraries.

[23:12:54]

sphery:

I just want "fully integrated"

[23:13:10]

wagnerrp:

sphery: in that case, we need backend plugins

[23:13:18]

iamlindoro:

ah-yup

[23:13:34]

sphery:

+1

[23:13:54]

sphery:

JS in Qt shouldn't be a problem, right? (After all, it has Webkit)

[23:14:00]

iamlindoro:

MNV should have a healthy backend portion-- but since we can't, updating feeds is very tricky

[23:14:23]

kormoc:

RDV_Linux: other the the language, what sets it apart from XSLT?

[23:14:26]

wagnerrp:

sphery: you mean for the browser portion?

[23:14:47]

sphery:

for creating an EMML runtime

[23:15:11]

kormoc:

sphery: Aye, create a dom with webkit and it should work with everything other then the java side that RDV_Linux mentioned

[23:15:16]

sphery:

since it would need to be able to run the JS that websites use so it could pull the info it needs to provide the info MNV needs

[23:15:55]

sphery:

The only thing the Java libs are required for is the JAX, IIUC

[23:16:21]

sphery:

so with the Qt XML libs, we would just replace them

[23:16:30]

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[23:16:42]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: I am sure that I am to new to XSLT but I found that a lot of the data massaging I needed to do xslt stylsheets were not up to the task.

[23:16:43]

RDV_Linux:

I used a combination javascript, Java libraries and EMML engine built in functions.

[23:17:30]

sphery:

RDV_Linux: oh, you're using Java stuff, too--not just the EMML runtime using Java?

[23:17:59]

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[23:18:42]

RDV_Linux:

The Emml engine allows you to include java library functions which I did in one case.

[23:19:14]

sphery:

oh, but nothing that couldn't be done in another language, right?

[23:19:36]

kormoc:

by emml engine, you mean just the reference implementation or is this planned to be a java only tech?

[23:19:40]

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[23:20:07]

Beirdo:

oh please... no Java in mythtv :)

[23:20:09]

** kormoc knows he could write the engine in php and still have access to the java layer, but knows that's not likely to help much **

[23:20:10]

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[23:20:12]

RDV_Linux:

Everything in EMML can be done in another language but it would have taken me a year at least to create all that functionality in my python grabbers.

[23:20:21]

** sphery thinks it's using http://www.openmashup.org/ 's reference imple **

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[23:20:40]

sphery:

RDV_Linux: yeah, I'm not saying you should have done it differently--I think you did it exactly right

[23:20:54]

Beirdo:

you think we have support issues now... just imagine having to support Java too

[23:20:56]

RDV_Linux:

sphery: Correct that is what I downloaded and used

[23:20:59]

kormoc:

Having EMML scripts being locked to a single engine seems rather... non-portable...

[23:21:12]

sphery:

I'm just wondering if it's even feasible to consider a fully-integrated custom-built engine for the future

[23:21:17]

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[23:21:19]

kormoc:

meaning, why have a standard if you can't interoperate with others that follow the standard?

[23:21:39]

sphery:

kormoc: TTBOMK, there's only a single implementation of an EMML runtime--and that's the reference implementation

[23:21:52]

sphery:

i.e. no one has gotten around to making another engine for it

[23:22:05]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: EMML is an open mashup implementation but there is only one GPL3 reference engine

[23:22:11]

kormoc:

sure, but if we got a c++/qt one, his java emml scripts won't work, which makes it seem worthless to write a c++/qt implementation

[23:22:58]

Beirdo:

Dirty Jobs marathon today, it seems

[23:23:18]

sphery:

Ah, I see what you mean... I don't know anything about the EMML scripts themselves, or about the engine's extensibility features (and whether they're supposed to be portable)

[23:23:51]

sphery:

I have a 35,000-ft view of EMML at this point (just started looking into what it was this evening)

[23:24:04]

sphery:

but I do think it's the way to go for future grabbers

[23:24:32]

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[23:24:44]

iamlindoro:

Personally I think the current implementation should be fine for a couple revisions, and if someone gets truly motivated and wants to write an engine, we can cross that bridge when we come to it

[23:24:46]

sphery:

but I think having our own mythmashup or mythemmlserver or whatever would be worthwhile--even if it required modifying the scripts he has now

[23:24:47]

kormoc:

yeah, I'm just confused as to if using language specific functionality is part of the spec, as they claim "Mashups written in EMML can be deployed to any EMML-compliant application", but using java directly seems to break that

[23:25:17]

sphery:

iamlindoro: agreed

[23:25:35]

kormoc:

It's great work, don't get me wrong, just attempting to understand it all ;)

[23:25:36]

RDV_Linux:

kormac: The grabber scripts use few Java classes so could easily be changed to use something that provides the same functionality.

[23:25:37]

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[23:25:38]

sphery:

and, for all my talking, I'm not really expecting anyone to create our own implementation anytime soon

[23:25:39]

iamlindoro:

sphery, yeah, It doesn't sound like anything in the current scripts is so irrevocably tied to java that it couldn't be ported to something else as necessary

[23:25:39]

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[23:26:51]

kormoc:

sphery: honestly, if it's really just dom scripting, it shouldn't be extremely hard to do so

[23:26:57]

kormoc:

which is what it really sounds like

[23:27:10]

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[23:27:16]

Beirdo:

reinventing the wheel yet again?

[23:27:33]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: If anything would need to be changed in the current emml mashup scripts it would be the need for in-line javascript which I use more of but still not in a dominate way.

[23:27:34]

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[23:27:44]

sphery:

I couldn't say--I haven't even seen the current work he's done, let alone the code for the EMML runtime

[23:27:52]

sphery:

but I hope that you're right

[23:27:58]

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[23:28:25]

sphery:

RDV_Linux: we should be able to do javascript without an issue with the webkit support for javascript

[23:28:27]

kormoc:

RDV_Linux: just wondering, everything I've read in the past 15 minutes seems like I can do it all in native-js if I could break the security policy, is that a fair statement?

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[23:28:56]

clever:

kormoc: have you looked at QScript?

[23:29:12]

** iamlindoro breathes and counts to ten **

[23:29:26]

wagnerrp:

'serenity now'

[23:29:31]

Beirdo:

heheeh

[23:29:34]

kormoc:

more -users fun? ;)

[23:29:41]

Beirdo:

have a festivus pole

[23:29:46]

clever:

QScript handled ECMA script, which is basicaly JS

[23:29:51]

sphery:

trying to remember what show serenity now is frm

[23:29:57]

RDV_Linux:

The one concern about a MythTV EMML implementation is that their TOS is fairly emphatic about no piece meal EMML implementations.

[23:30:04]

Beirdo:

sphery: Seinfeld

[23:30:07]

kormoc:

ooh

[23:30:11]

sphery:

ah, yeah

[23:30:16]

kormoc:

this isn't so easy

[23:30:22]

sphery:

thx... saved me the google

[23:30:42]

kormoc:

implementation engines need to fully support JavaScript, JRuby, Groovy, POJO, and xquery.

[23:30:42]

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[23:30:45]

kormoc:

That's a non-trivial list

[23:30:56]

sphery:

POJO?

[23:31:03]

sphery:

means implementations must be in Java

[23:31:03]

kormoc:

(and *extrememly* java heavy)

[23:31:06]

sphery:

yeah

[23:31:06]

clever:

javascript would be relatively easy (via qscript) but the rest i dont know

[23:31:14]

kormoc:

sphery: Plain Old Java Object

[23:31:17]

sphery:

can't do plain-old Java unless it's java

[23:31:20]

kormoc:

pretty much Java

[23:31:21]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: Over the last month I learned EMML, javascript, XPath and XSLT so I do not have enougn experience to answer your question "do it all in native-js".

[23:31:27]

sphery:

yeah, question was why would it require that

[23:31:30]

wagnerrp:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5513mXmQbw4 fortherestofus

[23:31:39]

kormoc:

RDV_Linux: fair 'nuff

[23:32:36]

kormoc:

RDV_Linux: I'm not sure if they can legally enforce the TOS with their engine being gplv3

[23:32:55]

kormoc:

they might be able to prevent us from saying it's EMML, but that's it

[23:33:14]

RDV_Linux:

kormoc: You guys would know better than I as I am new to this whole game.

[23:33:14]

Beirdo:

why would we CHOOSE to use something with a stupid TOS?

[23:33:41]

sphery:

I heard on the -users list that a ToS doesn't apply as long as you don't agree with it.

[23:33:46]

sphery:

so, quick, everyone disagree with it

[23:33:58]

Beirdo:

hehe

[23:34:02]

wagnerrp:

rabble rabble rabble

[23:34:11]

Beirdo:

!trout sphery smart-alec

[23:34:11]

** MythLogBot slaps sphery with a smart-alec trout on behalf of Beirdo... **

[23:34:11]

sphery:

IANAL (yet!)

[23:34:21]

sphery:

heh, I deserved that

[23:34:30]

Beirdo:

heh

[23:34:31]

kormoc:

ooh, has to support java datasource objects as well

[23:34:33]

Beirdo:

anyways.

[23:34:43]

kormoc:

this is a java only tech, not portable to other languages

[23:34:45]

Beirdo:

oh yeah, we want that... NOT :)

[23:35:15]

sphery:

so, basically, the "open" means GPL, not "interoperable standard"

[23:35:30]

sphery:

openmashup, open to Java--only!

[23:35:36]

kormoc:

Actually, I'm not sure they're actually gplv3 compliant

[23:35:46]

Beirdo:

and only if you follow their ToS?

[23:35:52]

kormoc:

they have redistribution restrictions

[23:35:55]

sphery:

or disagree with it

[23:35:56]

Beirdo:

doesn't sound too GPLv3 to mee

[23:36:06]

sphery:

but you can't use it on a TiVo!

[23:36:13]

Beirdo:

good :)

[23:36:19]

Beirdo:

tivo can rot in hell

[23:36:26]

wagnerrp:

so the 'standard' is open, but their reference implementation is not?

[23:36:47]

sphery:

open, but java only, standard, right?

[23:37:04]

kormoc:

the standard isn't really open, it's "Creative Commons Attribution-No Derivative Works"

[23:37:20]

sphery:

Enterprise Mashup Markup Language (EMML) Documentation is licensed

[23:37:20]

sphery:

under a Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 United States License

[23:37:29]

Beirdo:

No Derivative?!

[23:37:44]

kormoc:

http://www.openmashup.org/download/agreement.php

[23:38:00]

Beirdo:

so it's a "you can read my source but not really use it unless I change it for you"

[23:38:04]

kormoc:

both the schema and engine is no derivative

[23:38:09]

Beirdo:

sounds like DJB

[23:38:17]

sphery:

yeah, the schema is CCA-No Deriv

[23:38:58]

Beirdo:

CCA-Not Interested

[23:38:58]

kormoc:

yeah, the engine is not gpl

[23:39:05]

sphery:

did you d/l it?

[23:39:32]

sphery:

I'll bet you have to pay $15 for the font, too.

[23:39:36]

sphery:

iamlindoro: ^^^

[23:39:37]

kormoc:

it's downloading, but their agreement page says both the schema and the engine is CCA-ND

[23:39:52]

iamlindoro:

har har

[23:40:21]

Beirdo:

Creative Commons Attribution – Now Delete

[23:40:34]

sphery:

ah, yeah, I see ... I missed the "reference runtime implementation" when I was skimming that, so I thought it was only the schema

[23:42:58]

kormoc:

they don't give you the source to the reference runtime implementation

[23:43:08]

kormoc:

it's a .war file

[23:47:14]

sphery:

yeah, seems it's only the source of the client

[23:51:38]

dashcloud:

hi, I might be the only person who made this mistake, but I was checking for upcoming premieres, and saw Flash Forward is coming back soon, and wondered why my recording rule didn't trigger- it's because it's FlashForward not Flash Forward

[23:52:56]

kormoc:

to the post office!

[23:53:05]

sphery:

dashcloud: which listings provider?

[23:53:15]

dashcloud:

Schedules Direct

[23:53:30]

kormoc:

did the seriesid change?

[23:53:33]

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[23:53:36]

sphery:

hmmm... my rule is for flashforward without the space

[23:53:49]

dashcloud:

don't know- didn't record the first season of the show

[23:53:58]

wagnerrp:

first season?

[23:54:08]

wagnerrp:

theyre considering this the second season already?

[23:54:17]

kormoc:

nah, still the first

[23:55:14]

sphery:

for me, I have 10 eps in oldrecorded, all with same seriesid and title FlashForward

[23:55:48]

sphery:

from Sep 24, 2009 to Dec 3, 2009

[23:56:20]

sphery:

interesting that it was different for some users

[23:56:25]

dashcloud:

okay- I guess I never noticed the no space in the name then (it's corrected now)

[23:57:29]

sphery:

well, it's the thought that counts, and I really appreciate the thought--I'd have been very upset if I missed episodes (even though I haven't started watching the series, yet, I hate to lose the option when I'm missing episodes :)

[23:57:38]

sphery:

so thanks for the warning

[23:57:53]

sphery:

was definitely worth the time it took to verify my rules are still working :)

[23:58:16]

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[23:58:35]

k-man:

ah, i have one recording at 720, Stream #0.0[0x90a]: Video: mpeg2video, yuv420p, 1280x720 [PAR 1:1 DAR 16:9], 90000 kb/s, 50.00 tb(r)

[23:58:39]

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[23:58:51]

k-man:

you think a mac mini 1.8Ghz could play that?

[23:59:01]

wagnerrp:

certainly

[23:59:10]

** sphery is too slow, yet again **

[23:59:13]

wagnerrp:

(assuming its not actually 90Mbps)

[23:59:17]

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[23:59:21]

wagnerrp:

i think theyre lying to you

[23:59:36]

iamlindoro:

wrong line

[23:59:41]

k-man:

what do you mean? the bitrate is too slow?

[23:59:54]

iamlindoro:

that's the container bitrate, not the stream bitrate

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